Official Usmb Mafia Game #5: A Game Of Fire And Ice (day 6)

[Wolfsister77]

This is interesting. I have not seen Sam make the claim that he tracked by FA and Avatar on the same night. Why do you say this?

When House is on next he can confirm Sameech said this in the neighborhood QT #641.

@House

Hummmmm I believe you, he said he tracked BOTH FA and Avatar the same exact night?

Well, he said FA was town N1 and that sounds more like a cop than a tracker.

He said he saw Avi kill Rosie-well Rosie was killed N1.


So he has to be claiming both nights he watched 2 peoople and the results are odd also.

Did he say that as a result of his investigation, or was he just saying he thought FA was town.

Has he claimed who he watched Night 3?

He did not say who he watched/tracked N3. In 641 he said FA was town due to being a Night Watchman and specified N1. IN 687 he reminded me he confirmed FA was town. He's not too happy with this line of questioning but I have to at least ask.

I was a tracker in game 3.

The only result I got was "So and so did not visit anyone" or "so and so visited Mary". That was all I got from Wake. So I am not sure how Sam could have been so sure FA was town even if he got a no result. I don't recall him stating he was sure FA was town until AFTER he was NKed by scum. BUT again, I may have missed this, as you all know I am a bit off due to surgery/meds.

Cafe, if FA was town (and we now know he was) and Sameech tracked him, getting a "FA did not visit anyone" would indicate that FA was town. Town don't go visiting anyone at night.

Not if there were two scum alive from a team because one could of NOT done the night kill and it would show they didn't visit anyone.

 

[Wolfsister77]

If we could massclaim Scarlet's claim is probably p verifiable, but we probably won't.

What does this mean? Massclaim?

Everyone claims. All but 4 have already done so. It's sometimes a good idea to narrow down who scum is and sometimes it is a bad idea to out people because it gives info. to scum on who to kill at night. It's a case by case situation.

Okay, so what you are saying is, if everyone claims we can see if there is a yang to Sam which there should be given he is claiming odd night tracker.

Both Sam and SR. The down side is, this might help scum pick off targets or narrow who they are going to shoot. Fire wouldn't shoot fire proof for example.

 

[CaféAuLait]

This is interesting. I have not seen Sam make the claim that he tracked by FA and Avatar on the same night. Why do you say this?

When House is on next he can confirm Sameech said this in the neighborhood QT #641.

@House

Hummmmm I believe you, he said he tracked BOTH FA and Avatar the same exact night?

Well, he said FA was town N1 and that sounds more like a cop than a tracker.

He said he saw Avi kill Rosie-well Rosie was killed N1.


So he has to be claiming both nights he watched 2 peoople and the results are odd also.

Did he say that as a result of his investigation, or was he just saying he thought FA was town.

Has he claimed who he watched Night 3?

He did not say who he watched/tracked N3. In 641 he said FA was town due to being a Night Watchman and specified N1. IN 687 he reminded me he confirmed FA was town. He's not too happy with this line of questioning but I have to at least ask.

I was a tracker in game 3.

The only result I got was "So and so did not visit anyone" or "so and so visited Mary". That was all I got from Wake. So I am not sure how Sam could have been so sure FA was town even if he got a no result. I don't recall him stating he was sure FA was town until AFTER he was NKed by scum. BUT again, I may have missed this, as you all know I am a bit off due to surgery/meds.

Cafe, if FA was town (and we now know he was) and Sameech tracked him, getting a "FA did not visit anyone" would indicate that FA was town. Town don't go visiting anyone at night.

Not if FA had a scum partner. I clarified this with Wake when I was tracker. I thought they all went together, but only one makes the kill. I know FA is town. I just was not sure how Sam would know FA was town so sure. That is all. And Wolf clarified Sam said FA was town BEFORE he was lynched. I thought it was after. I was wrong.

 

[Mertex]

This is interesting. I have not seen Sam make the claim that he tracked by FA and Avatar on the same night. Why do you say this?

When House is on next he can confirm Sameech said this in the neighborhood QT #641.

@House

Hummmmm I believe you, he said he tracked BOTH FA and Avatar the same exact night?

Well, he said FA was town N1 and that sounds more like a cop than a tracker.

He said he saw Avi kill Rosie-well Rosie was killed N1.


So he has to be claiming both nights he watched 2 peoople and the results are odd also.

Did he say that as a result of his investigation, or was he just saying he thought FA was town.

Has he claimed who he watched Night 3?

He did not say who he watched/tracked N3. In 641 he said FA was town due to being a Night Watchman and specified N1. IN 687 he reminded me he confirmed FA was town. He's not too happy with this line of questioning but I have to at least ask.

I was a tracker in game 3.

The only result I got was "So and so did not visit anyone" or "so and so visited Mary". That was all I got from Wake. So I am not sure how Sam could have been so sure FA was town even if he got a no result. I don't recall him stating he was sure FA was town until AFTER he was NKed by scum. BUT again, I may have missed this, as you all know I am a bit off due to surgery/meds.

Well, 641 was made on 9-4 in our hood which is before the NK. He was right FA was town but I am confused how he could know that and see Avi kill Rosie on the same night plus these are 2 different results-a tracker result and a cop result. Sameech is going to have to clarify this if he can.

If Sameech is Scum with a tracker ability, he could have tracked FA and found out he was Town, (and made that public so that the other Mafia team might take a shot at him later, which they did). Also, as Scum, Ice might have targeted Avatar and got a failed kill. He could have certainly done that in one night.

 

[CaféAuLait]

If we could massclaim Scarlet's claim is probably p verifiable, but we probably won't.

What does this mean? Massclaim?

Everyone claims. All but 4 have already done so. It's sometimes a good idea to narrow down who scum is and sometimes it is a bad idea to out people because it gives info. to scum on who to kill at night. It's a case by case situation.

Okay, so what you are saying is, if everyone claims we can see if there is a yang to Sam which there should be given he is claiming odd night tracker.

Both Sam and SR. The down side is, this might help scum pick off targets or narrow who they are going to shoot. Fire wouldn't shoot fire proof for example.

Right. So SR's yang would be taking a big chance in claiming. DON'T CLAIM ANYONE, I WAS JUST thinking out loud.

 

[CaféAuLait]

This is interesting. I have not seen Sam make the claim that he tracked by FA and Avatar on the same night. Why do you say this?

When House is on next he can confirm Sameech said this in the neighborhood QT #641.

@House

Hummmmm I believe you, he said he tracked BOTH FA and Avatar the same exact night?

Well, he said FA was town N1 and that sounds more like a cop than a tracker.

He said he saw Avi kill Rosie-well Rosie was killed N1.


So he has to be claiming both nights he watched 2 peoople and the results are odd also.

Did he say that as a result of his investigation, or was he just saying he thought FA was town.

Has he claimed who he watched Night 3?

He did not say who he watched/tracked N3. In 641 he said FA was town due to being a Night Watchman and specified N1. IN 687 he reminded me he confirmed FA was town. He's not too happy with this line of questioning but I have to at least ask.

I was a tracker in game 3.

The only result I got was "So and so did not visit anyone" or "so and so visited Mary". That was all I got from Wake. So I am not sure how Sam could have been so sure FA was town even if he got a no result. I don't recall him stating he was sure FA was town until AFTER he was NKed by scum. BUT again, I may have missed this, as you all know I am a bit off due to surgery/meds.

Well, 641 was made on 9-4 in our hood which is before the NK. He was right FA was town but I am confused how he could know that and see Avi kill Rosie on the same night plus these are 2 different results-a tracker result and a cop result. Sameech is going to have to clarify this if he can.

If Sameech is Scum with a tracker ability, he could have tracked FA and found out he was Town, (and made that public so that the other Mafia team might take a shot at him later, which they did). Also, as Scum, Ice might have targeted Avatar and got a failed kill. He could have certainly done that in one night.

You know I can't imagine Wake would have given tracker PR to scum. Is there a possibility there is no tracker, yes. But I can't see why he would give that PR to scum. Roleblocker, like last game, maybe. But not that PR, it would put us even further behind the 8 ball and give even more power to scum. I don't think PR's are randomized, like the abilities were, are they?

 

[Mertex]

Avatar did thank Aye and Rosie, it was shortly after he was lynched and in twilight IIRC. Aye asked us in Central about abilities and PR's. IIRC Grandma did too. The lie you are speaking about between you and grandma is just silly and I don't think it would have made you scummy, since Rosie could verify and did. Aye stated she said Rosie was important, etc because we were eyeing Rosie for lynch, which is true- since her meta was off.

I don't know that you can say that the lie would not have made me scummy, I was at L-1 due to her claiming that I was lying about the shield and that I was more valuable alive than dead. That is what forced me to claim in the first place. Before that I had just implied that I had an important role.

 

[House]

I don't think PR's are randomized, like the abilities were, are they?

I hope not, because scum cop/doc would just be broken.

 

[CaféAuLait]

Avatar did thank Aye and Rosie, it was shortly after he was lynched and in twilight IIRC. Aye asked us in Central about abilities and PR's. IIRC Grandma did too. The lie you are speaking about between you and grandma is just silly and I don't think it would have made you scummy, since Rosie could verify and did. Aye stated she said Rosie was important, etc because we were eyeing Rosie for lynch, which is true- since her meta was off.

I don't know that you can say that the lie would not have made me scummy, I was at L-1 due to her claiming that I was lying about the shield and that I was more valuable alive than dead. That is what forced me to claim in the first place. Before that I had just implied that I had an important role.

Mertex, it was not just the meatshield, ( which wake said you could have used on Rosie) but I am not going back. It was not just Grandma's assertions either. Lets leave that in the past and not revisit it, Okay? It will be counterintuitive to the progress we are making as a team.

I thought the lie you were referring to was the one about you using your ability or declaring your ability.

 

[CaféAuLait]

I don't think PR's are randomized, like the abilities were, are they?

I hope not, because scum cop/doc would just be broken.

Indeed.

 

[Mertex]

Mertex the point of that, and me wanting to know who you healed, is trying to track who icescum targeted definitively.

But there were so many different powers at play, there is no certain way to find out other than Wake telling us, who was targeted and why it failed.

I honestly think it may help Mertex, I don't see any reason not to say who you have protected the last few nights. I can't imagine it hurting anything. I may be wrong because I am newish to the game, but I can't see how it can hurt to state who you protected the last few nights now. If there is anyone who thinks I am wrong please speak up. I also see the point you are making it could cause confusion, but it seems to me SR is able to parse information pretty well.

I revealed that I protected tn N1. Night 2 and 3 are irrelevant, because we know that N2 they both attempted the same person and cancelled, or targeted each other and cancelled. N3 they both got their targets, which were Town and obviously not the one I protected. I will reveal later, if I see where it might help town, right now I don't see how it makes a difference.

 

[sameech]

[
I was a tracker in game 3.

The only result I got was "So and so did not visit anyone" or "so and so visited Mary". That was all I got from Wake. So I am not sure how Sam could have been so sure FA was town even if he got a no result. I don't recall him stating he was sure FA was town until AFTER he was NKed by scum. BUT again, I may have missed this, as you all know I am a bit off due to surgery/meds.

I never claimed to be the tracker. I am a night watchman. Avatar made it easy to sostion of tracking FA.
rt him out as scum of Rosie's night 1 visitors. I know who visits a target at night, not who my target visits. Wolf knew this before FA flipped town because I told her in the neighborhood when she wanted me to follow SR's suggested track of FA when I indicated I probably wouldn't sit on him as the watchman. Why she is so loyal to Avatar is beyond me, so since Avatar felt a need to point out to her that he told her there was two scum in that neighborhood, I cannot think of a better Ice Mafia candidate at the moment, especially in light of her messing up the TN lynch. She also got on the railroading me thing right after I pointed out in the neighborhood that if we mislynched, then we have to kill the fire scum player to even stay in the game. Any mislynch mathematically will eliminate us and a mass claim serves no purpose other than to help scum pick their targets.

VOTE: WOLFSISTER

 

[CaféAuLait]

Mertex the point of that, and me wanting to know who you healed, is trying to track who icescum targeted definitively.

But there were so many different powers at play, there is no certain way to find out other than Wake telling us, who was targeted and why it failed.

I honestly think it may help Mertex, I don't see any reason not to say who you have protected the last few nights. I can't imagine it hurting anything. I may be wrong because I am newish to the game, but I can't see how it can hurt to state who you protected the last few nights now. If there is anyone who thinks I am wrong please speak up. I also see the point you are making it could cause confusion, but it seems to me SR is able to parse information pretty well.

I revealed that I protected tn N1. Night 2 and 3 are irrelevant, because we know that N2 they both attempted the same person and cancelled, or targeted each other and cancelled. N3 they both got their targets, which were Town and obviously not the one I protected. I will reveal later, if I see where it might help town, right now I don't see how it makes a difference.

Well. it actually might give info. For instance, in Central, Sam IIRC was convinced TN was using you as a pawn to get himself protected as scum. Which really made no sense since scum can't kill scum, BUT he explained it in a manner which I really was confused about a little, I hope I am not relaying it incorrectly, what he meant. So to know TN was protected ( if scum could kill scum) may have helped narrow down why he was targeted.

 

[sameech]

BTW, if there is a mislynch, one of the remaining Ice team can out themselves and coordinate night targets at twilight and we are completely eliminated today.

 

[Mertex]

This is interesting. I have not seen Sam make the claim that he tracked by FA and Avatar on the same night. Why do you say this?

When House is on next he can confirm Sameech said this in the neighborhood QT #641.

@House

Hummmmm I believe you, he said he tracked BOTH FA and Avatar the same exact night?

Well, he said FA was town N1 and that sounds more like a cop than a tracker.

He said he saw Avi kill Rosie-well Rosie was killed N1.


So he has to be claiming both nights he watched 2 peoople and the results are odd also.

Did he say that as a result of his investigation, or was he just saying he thought FA was town.

Has he claimed who he watched Night 3?

He did not say who he watched/tracked N3. In 641 he said FA was town due to being a Night Watchman and specified N1. IN 687 he reminded me he confirmed FA was town. He's not too happy with this line of questioning but I have to at least ask.

I was a tracker in game 3.

The only result I got was "So and so did not visit anyone" or "so and so visited Mary". That was all I got from Wake. So I am not sure how Sam could have been so sure FA was town even if he got a no result. I don't recall him stating he was sure FA was town until AFTER he was NKed by scum. BUT again, I may have missed this, as you all know I am a bit off due to surgery/meds.

Cafe, if FA was town (and we now know he was) and Sameech tracked him, getting a "FA did not visit anyone" would indicate that FA was town. Town don't go visiting anyone at night.

How would Sam visit both FA & Avatar on N1, is the question.

I think I've already given the answer but, I'll do it again. If Sameech is Scum, and the tracker, he could have tracked FA and gotten a (FA did not visit anyone) response which would indicate FA is Town because we know that Townies don't visit at night. As Scum, he could have also targeted Avi for the kill and gotten a message telling him Avi was Scum (Wake said in the rules that Scum will find out who the other Scum are when they target them and get a cancel).

 

[CaféAuLait]

[
I was a tracker in game 3.

The only result I got was "So and so did not visit anyone" or "so and so visited Mary". That was all I got from Wake. So I am not sure how Sam could have been so sure FA was town even if he got a no result. I don't recall him stating he was sure FA was town until AFTER he was NKed by scum. BUT again, I may have missed this, as you all know I am a bit off due to surgery/meds.

I never claimed to be the tracker. I am a night watchman. Avatar made it easy to sostion of tracking FA.
rt him out as scum of Rosie's night 1 visitors. I know who visits a target at night, not who my target visits. Wolf knew this before FA flipped town because I told her in the neighborhood when she wanted me to follow SR's suggested track of FA when I indicated I probably wouldn't sit on him as the watchman. Why she is so loyal to Avatar is beyond me, so since Avatar felt a need to point out to her that he told her there was two scum in that neighborhood, I cannot think of a better Ice Mafia candidate at the moment, especially in light of her messing up the TN lynch. She also got on the railroading me thing right after I pointed out in the neighborhood that if we mislynched, then we have to kill the fire scum player to even stay in the game. Any mislynch mathematically will eliminate us and a mass claim serves no purpose other than to help scum pick their targets.

VOTE: WOLFSISTER

Wow, that is a cool ability. So you see anyone who visits your chosen target?

Woah, so you saw FA give Rosie the keys? That is why you knew FA was town?

 

[Mertex]

Not if there were two scum alive from a team because one could of NOT done the night kill and it would show they didn't visit anyone.

I can't make sense of your post, can you clarify what you are saying, if my answer doesn't cover what you are trying to say?

Only one member of the Scum team orders the kill. How do you know that Sameech didn't do the tracking and the ordering of the night-kill?

 

[CaféAuLait]

This is interesting. I have not seen Sam make the claim that he tracked by FA and Avatar on the same night. Why do you say this?

When House is on next he can confirm Sameech said this in the neighborhood QT #641.

@House

Hummmmm I believe you, he said he tracked BOTH FA and Avatar the same exact night?

Well, he said FA was town N1 and that sounds more like a cop than a tracker.

He said he saw Avi kill Rosie-well Rosie was killed N1.


So he has to be claiming both nights he watched 2 peoople and the results are odd also.

Did he say that as a result of his investigation, or was he just saying he thought FA was town.

Has he claimed who he watched Night 3?

He did not say who he watched/tracked N3. In 641 he said FA was town due to being a Night Watchman and specified N1. IN 687 he reminded me he confirmed FA was town. He's not too happy with this line of questioning but I have to at least ask.

I was a tracker in game 3.

The only result I got was "So and so did not visit anyone" or "so and so visited Mary". That was all I got from Wake. So I am not sure how Sam could have been so sure FA was town even if he got a no result. I don't recall him stating he was sure FA was town until AFTER he was NKed by scum. BUT again, I may have missed this, as you all know I am a bit off due to surgery/meds.

Cafe, if FA was town (and we now know he was) and Sameech tracked him, getting a "FA did not visit anyone" would indicate that FA was town. Town don't go visiting anyone at night.

How would Sam visit both FA & Avatar on N1, is the question.

I think I've already given the answer but, I'll do it again. If Sameech is Scum, and the tracker, he could have tracked FA and gotten a (FA did not visit anyone) response which would indicate FA is Town because we know that Townies don't visit at night. As Scum, he could have also targeted Avi for the kill and gotten a message telling him Avi was Scum (Wake said in the rules that Scum will find out who the other Scum are when they target them and get a cancel).

Agin you are missing the fact if FA had been scum his partener would have been the only one to visit. But that is moot now.
I think you are confused because Sam is claiming odd night watchmen only. So he had only one shot to see this happening on night 1, he could not have seen both things happening as I explained the role of tracker. But this was just explained above, he is not the tracker but claims watchman.

 

[CaféAuLait]

Not if there were two scum alive from a team because one could of NOT done the night kill and it would show they didn't visit anyone.

I can't make sense of your post, can you clarify what you are saying, if my answer doesn't cover what you are trying to say?

Only one member of the Scum team orders the kill. How do you know that Sameech didn't do the tracking and the ordering of the night-kill?

Because he is odd night only Mertex and he claimed to see what two people were doing on night 1, he would have results from night 3 and 1 only and knew FA was town prior to night 3. Again this is moot given he is claiming watchman not tracker.

 

[Wolfsister77]

Not if there were two scum alive from a team because one could of NOT done the night kill and it would show they didn't visit anyone.

I can't make sense of your post, can you clarify what you are saying, if my answer doesn't cover what you are trying to say?

Only one member of the Scum team orders the kill. How do you know that Sameech didn't do the tracking and the ordering of the night-kill?

I am saying if a tracker visits a target and gets the result they didn't visit anyone, that is not a clear if multiple scum are alive because they could be scum that didn't carry out the kill.

I doubt scum would be given a tracker ability in this setup.