One very very easy and simple way to cut health care costs 50% tomorrow:

[Shrimpbox]

Free Healthcare? |

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Cuba is one example of extreme socialism.

1) in USSR and Red China food was free too yet 120 million slowly starved to death.
2) In Cuba they do give give decent free health care to all but nothing else. Average income is $300/year.
3) Cuba is a Nazi concentration camp. The only tropical island in history where boats are illegal.

Sorry to rock your world!!

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Think of socialism as the optimal way to distribute a nation's wealth resource.

100% stupid!! not for those who have their private property taken away at gun point to take care of the leeches, and not for the poor leeches either who learn that liberal theft is how you get ahead in life.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

If Cuba had unlimited emigration there would not be any doctors in Cuba.

if boats were legal in Cuba concentration camp they would have no doctors!! LIberals love Cuba and spied for Stalin-always America's primary enemy.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Mike k and luddly offer a perfect picture of our health care system. If everyone was as sane as mike we would have no problems, but mike forgets that democratic trial,lawyers are following most patients around, don't think they have those in European countries luddly. And unfortunately not all the patients are ex military and commonsensical. Health care costs are through the roof because of so many unnecessary tests ordered by doctors who are afraid of being sued and paying even more insurance because of democratic trial lawyers. Liberals of course will not address this.

good post but I think both sides agree that lawyers only add 1-2% to our legal bills. Real problems is libsocialist govt monopolies that are very very inefficient. All we need to do is publish prices.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

it[capitalism] inevitably will devolve into a two-class system of redundant wealth and extreme poverty

obviously not since folks like Steve Jobs need everyone to be wealthy enough to afford their products.

If Bill Gates has a big fortune then so must America which can afford to buy the latest technology from him. That's the pure beauty of capitalism. You want to get rich? Its easy if you have great new products and 100 million customers or so who are wealthy enough to afford what you're selling.

 

[Shrimpbox]

Have you seen an obgyn insurance bill? At least the ones that are still,practicing. I agree with you special ed about posting prices. A colonoscopy costs 5 grand if you pay cash, 3500 if you have ins. The surgeons cost for my back operation was 12,000. They screwed up and didn't file correctly so after a year they said I could pay the Medicare rate of 1700. Yeah, something is wrong with the system

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

. Yeah, something is wrong with the system

not something but rather a libsocialist bureaucracy with no Republican capitalist incentives. Remember East/West Germany??

 

[MikeK]

not something but rather a libsocialist bureaucracy with no Republican capitalist incentives. Remember East/West Germany??

I'd like to know what you think of Social Security, Medicare, and public schools. They are socialist programs. Do you think they should be eliminated? Or do you think some socialist programs and policies impart a positive effect within a capitalist system?

Are you in favor of or opposed to a free college education for anyone who can pass the SAT?

Are you in favor of free universal health care?

 

[MikeK]

Have you seen an obgyn insurance bill? At least the ones that are still,practicing. I agree with you special ed about posting prices. A colonoscopy costs 5 grand if you pay cash, 3500 if you have ins. The surgeons cost for my back operation was 12,000. They screwed up and didn't file correctly so after a year they said I could pay the Medicare rate of 1700. Yeah, something is wrong with the system

You are quite correct. Something certainly is wrong with the System. It needs another President like FDR to take hold of it by the horns.

 

[CowboyTed]

I once noticed a rapidly swelling infected finger on a Friday afternoon too late to bring it to my GP, so I went to the local emergency room. There I waited two hours to be interviewed by a social worker, then waited another two hours to be "seen" by a tired, annoyed intern who decided the infection needed to be drained -- which it didn't. All I needed was a prescription for penicillin (I've had that problem before).

Bottom line; after a painful, wholly unnecessary swipe with a scalpel, a sloppy, bulky bandage and a prescription for some exotic antibiotic, my insurer (GHI) was billed $430 and I had a $165 co-pay. Five hundred and ninety-five dollars for a lot of wasteful bureaucratic bullshit and absolutely redundant medical attention.

I've had that problem before (for some reason I am prone to infected fingers if I get the slightest cut). It happened twice when I was in the Marines. Each time it happened I simply walked into Sick Bay, an enlisted Navy Medical Corpsman took a look at the finger, handed me a little box of penicillin tablets -- and next day the infection was completely gone.

The point I wish to make is there is a compelling need for walk-in clinics staffed by former military medics and civilian EMTs who know how to diagnose and treat minor problems, which account for 90% (or more) of all emergency room visits. Those occasional problems which are over the heads of these medics can be referred to an ER if a physician is not present at the clinic.

These walk-in clinics would eliminate the need for attention by physicians thus dramatically reducing the consequent health care costs. I believe such a situation exists in Cuba, where the health care system is vastly superior to ours. The first step toward implementing such a system here in the U.S. would be to crush the health insurance industry, which is represented by an extremely powerful (well financed) Washington lobby.

There are thousands of highly experienced military medics, nurses, and EMTs whose acquired expertise would qualify them to provide a function which does not require the attention of an MD.

Solid suggestion... We have such places in Ireland (24 GP service) but I saw it a lot more in the UK... UK is really good, day or night there is always someone quickly available... I was in Spain as well and it was great too...

All these are subsidised to the eyeballs or just basically paid for by the Government... There is sometimes a small charge <$50. It would never be really economical from a commercial setting but does save vasts sums from ER depts...

 

[CowboyTed]

I once noticed a rapidly swelling infected finger on a Friday afternoon too late to bring it to my GP, so I went to the local emergency room. There I waited two hours to be interviewed by a social worker, then waited another two hours to be "seen" by a tired, annoyed intern who decided the infection needed to be drained -- which it didn't. All I needed was a prescription for penicillin (I've had that problem before).

Bottom line; after a painful, wholly unnecessary swipe with a scalpel, a sloppy, bulky bandage and a prescription for some exotic antibiotic, my insurer (GHI) was billed $430 and I had a $165 co-pay. Five hundred and ninety-five dollars for a lot of wasteful bureaucratic bullshit and absolutely redundant medical attention.

I've had that problem before (for some reason I am prone to infected fingers if I get the slightest cut). It happened twice when I was in the Marines. Each time it happened I simply walked into Sick Bay, an enlisted Navy Medical Corpsman took a look at the finger, handed me a little box of penicillin tablets -- and next day the infection was completely gone.

The point I wish to make is there is a compelling need for walk-in clinics staffed by former military medics and civilian EMTs who know how to diagnose and treat minor problems, which account for 90% (or more) of all emergency room visits. Those occasional problems which are over the heads of these medics can be referred to an ER if a physician is not present at the clinic.

These walk-in clinics would eliminate the need for attention by physicians thus dramatically reducing the consequent health care costs. I believe such a situation exists in Cuba, where the health care system is vastly superior to ours. The first step toward implementing such a system here in the U.S. would be to crush the health insurance industry, which is represented by an extremely powerful (well financed) Washington lobby.

There are thousands of highly experienced military medics, nurses, and EMTs whose acquired expertise would qualify them to provide a function which does not require the attention of an MD.

You brought back a memory - in college, pulled open a heavy metal door that was stuck, wearing sandals and the door ripped off the top of my big toe.

Leaving a trail of blood, I went hunting for college nurse who turned out to be a Vietnam medic who was very cool and didn't get all hysterical about the rather nasty thing I had done to myself.

You have a good point about using the skills our people learned in war. That's what Obama and First Lady Michelle were talking about and what the Rs refused.

In theory, we have that now - in urgent care facilities but, as you say, they're manned by MDs.

Many won't like it but there is a fast growing underground of just the kind of medically trained people you describe, doing abortions in people's homes.

Another point about what you suggest is that if we changed to the type of system AND ATTITUDE we see in European countries, it would have the same effect.

In this country, we still see doctors as gods. In Europe (in my own experience), they are highly skilled but so are ancillary positions.

I was stunned at what I found in pharmacies. They were as well trained as our MDs and paid as well as their MDs.

capitalism frees up most people to practice medicine. It is only govt regulation by special interests that prevents it now

Lets look how stupid this comment is... US has the most expensive system in the world and is also one of the most privatized... The cheaper systems have more Government involvement, that is basic fact... The more Government involvement the cheaper it is...

So this clown says more private... Doubling down on stupid...

 

[Mac1958]

Wow, 50% savings, overnight.

That's all we gotta do.

I'm sure there's empirical evidence of this.
.

 

[AntonToo]

Wow, 50% savings, overnight.

That's all we gotta do.

I'm sure there's empirical evidence of this.
.

When you are born yesterday tommorow seems like a lifetime.

 

[CowboyTed]

Have you seen an obgyn insurance bill? At least the ones that are still,practicing. I agree with you special ed about posting prices. A colonoscopy costs 5 grand if you pay cash, 3500 if you have ins. The surgeons cost for my back operation was 12,000. They screwed up and didn't file correctly so after a year they said I could pay the Medicare rate of 1700. Yeah, something is wrong with the system

Here is a laugh in Europe prices are set by the negotiated lowest rate, which is usually the one the Government is getting for bulk buying for its national care... Under equality law that rate has to be offered to all other consumers, it is considered discrimination to charge more to one group than another in this situation...

I am sorry to tell you but Big Pharma has been giving money to GOP at three times the rate of Dems...

Drug Bill Demonstrates Lobby's Pull

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Lets look how stupid this comment is... US has the most expensive system in the world and is also one of the most privatized... The cheaper systems have more Government involvement, that is basic fact... The more Government involvement the cheaper it is...

So this clown says more private... Doubling down on stupid...

so would you advise China to switch back to govt involvement socialism wherein 60 million human souls slowly starved to death or to move forward with more Republican capitalism wherein everyone is getting rich???

When a conservative and liberal meet the conservative is running a kindergarten.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Wow, 50% savings, overnight.

That's all we gotta do.

I'm sure there's empirical evidence of this.
.

yes, when prices are published people can empirically compare prices and pick the lower one.
This is the essence of capitalism. Do you understand?

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

I am sorry to tell you but Big Pharma has been giving money to GOP at three times the rate of Dems...

so we want to clamp down on big pharma so they will have less money with which to find a cure for cancer? Seems like an obviously good liberal idea!!

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

It would never be really economical from a commercial setting but does save vasts sums from ER depts...

ER's would be very very cheap indeed if operated in Republican capitalist environment.

 

[Mr Natural]

Lets look how stupid this comment is... US has the most expensive system in the world and is also one of the most privatized... The cheaper systems have more Government involvement, that is basic fact... The more Government involvement the cheaper it is...

So this clown says more private... Doubling down on stupid...

so would you advise China to switch back to govt involvement socialism wherein 60 million human souls slowly starved to death or to move forward with more Republican capitalism wherein everyone is getting rich???

When a conservative and liberal meet the conservative is running a kindergarten.

China has socialized medicine.