Poll: Do you want the Federal governemnt running all healthcare?

[kyzr]

I remember Obama's promise that Obamacare would save all families about $2,500 a year, it actually cost them about $10,000 a year in deductibles, meaning that they basically pay premiums AND pay deductibles to see a doctor. McCain really screwed up not killing Obamacare when he had the chance.

The democrats are running on "single payer" Medicare for all, where the government pays for all healthcare, and its FREE when needed. I can't imagine the lines of people waiting to see doctors. I wonder what GS pay grade doctors would get?

These two links basically prove two main points:
1. About 20% of the population uses 80% of the healthcare system. Can you say "pre-existing conditions"?
Does 20% of the population really use 80% of health care dollars?
2. The bottom 50% of the population by income pays basically nothing for healthcare
How do health expenditures vary across the population? - Peterson-Kaiser Health System Tracker

How can we improve the US healthcare system?
1. The bottom half of the population needs to work to get healthcare, medicaid needs to be cut
2. The 20% of the sickest need top pay more for healthcare since they use most of the resource

Any better ideas??

Several.

First of all, people need to be getting their health insurance individually, the way they buy every other insurance they use, rather than being dependent on an employer to decide which plan is going to be offered and how much it's going to cost them. This would require several things.

1) Allow health insurance to be sold across state lines to increase competition.
2) Allow insurance companies more scope to tailor policies and coverage to what their customers want to buy.
3) Give individual purchasers the same sort of tax breaks on their insurance that employers currently enjoy.
4) Allow customers to form their own associations through which to buy insurance and get discounts available for larger customer pools.

Second of all, the patients need to also be the customers when it comes to using healthcare. Rather than mandating expansion of EVERY policy to cover EVERY possible use of medical care, we need to expand the use and availability of HSA and flexible spending accounts. Instead of sending premiums to an insurance company every paycheck, that money goes into an account pre-tax, and waits there for you to use it. And then when you need to visit a doctor, YOU see the prices, YOU decide what to spend and where. Prices for medical care will become lower and less obscure when doctors aren't having to figure out how to get around a bunch of bean-counters and algorithms at some insurance company.

Heard all this before for saving Obamacare. If 20% of the population uses 80% of the healthcare resources they need to pay more. The rest of us can't afford the high deductibles to keep everyone alive to 100. There needs to be lifetime limits on what we can afford, or the entire system will collapse. Medicare will be insolvent in 2026. Medicaid needs to be cut and managed better....
The real reason health care is bankrupting America

 

[Cecilie1200]

I remember Obama's promise that Obamacare would save all families about $2,500 a year, it actually cost them about $10,000 a year in deductibles, meaning that they basically pay premiums AND pay deductibles to see a doctor. McCain really screwed up not killing Obamacare when he had the chance.

The democrats are running on "single payer" Medicare for all, where the government pays for all healthcare, and its FREE when needed. I can't imagine the lines of people waiting to see doctors. I wonder what GS pay grade doctors would get?

These two links basically prove two main points:
1. About 20% of the population uses 80% of the healthcare system. Can you say "pre-existing conditions"?
Does 20% of the population really use 80% of health care dollars?
2. The bottom 50% of the population by income pays basically nothing for healthcare
How do health expenditures vary across the population? - Peterson-Kaiser Health System Tracker

How can we improve the US healthcare system?
1. The bottom half of the population needs to work to get healthcare, medicaid needs to be cut
2. The 20% of the sickest need top pay more for healthcare since they use most of the resource

Any better ideas??

1. Are you willing to let the bottom half die in the streets if they cannot afford to pay for their healthcare?

2. They already pay more. My son is a Type-1 diabetic, the cost associated with that are enormous and I wonder how people manage.

There are a lot of problems with our system. I know a guy, he is about 28 or so, that was in between job and ended up in the ER and was diagnosed with Chrons disease. He spent 4 days in the hospital without insurance and will likely never be able to pay off what he owes. This is a problem with our system.

Around the time my mom and step-dad hit 70 they sold all their land and their house to my sister and BIL and essentially rented their house to avoid losing it all to the high cost of end of life care. This should not be necessary.

The problem in our country is we treat healthcare as both a commodity and a service. That cannot work in the long run.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

So, whats your solution? Big brother?

My solution is that “we the people” need to decide if healthcare is a commodity or a service.

If it is a commodity then those without the means to pay for it do not get it, just like every other commodity. Laws that mandate ERs, medical personnel and hospitals provide care must be taken off the books.

If it is a service then it should be treated like the police or fire department.


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

I'd say some basic level of healthcare is a right of every citizen.

You cannot have a "right" to someone else's goods and services. Please stop defining words according to your "feelz". If you want to say, "I think we as a country should provide a basic level of healthcare to people who can't afford it", then say that. But don't try to turn "rights" into a buzzword to cover every "If we were all perfect in a perfect world" fantasy you have.

 

[kyzr]

Yes because of government interference, when I was making 12 an hour 20 years ago I had the best insurance plan for 30 bucks a week. Fast forward to today. It’s out of control. Thanks to the government

Government keeps getting involved as it gets more expensive.

you have that backwards,,,it keeps getting more expensive because the government is involved,,,

just like with college tuition they know its a guaranteed check so they bump the price

Thé Government is not regulating enough

See the price of prescriptions vs countries with strict regulations?

Hello? McFly? Tuition prices were normal until the government stepped in to "help".
Then came relaxed admission standards, inflated tuition and book prices, and more cushy administrative jobs because hey, Uncle Sugar will pick up the tab. It's fucking sickening.

To think the exact same thing would not happen with medical care is folly.

Bull shit

Prescription prices were affordable until Big Pharm bought out our Congress

What are Nancy and the dems in the House doing to reduce drug costs? Thanks for playing.

"(Reuters) - The cost of insulin for treating type 1 diabetes in the United States nearly doubled over a five-year period, underscoring a national outcry over rising drug prices, according to a new analysis shared with Reuters. A person with type 1 diabetes incurred annual insulin costs of $5,705, on average, in 2016."
U.S. insulin costs per patient nearly doubled from 2012 to 2016: study - Reuters

CVS cuts cost for generic EpiPen competitor
The drugstore chain announced Thursday that it will sell a generic version of Impax Laboratories (IPXL)' Adrenaclick treatment for $109.99 per two-pack, down from $200. The drug company Mylan drew the ire of customers and Congress when it raised the price to more than $600 for an EpiPen two-pack.

 

[progressive hunter]

Government keeps getting involved as it gets more expensive.

you have that backwards,,,it keeps getting more expensive because the government is involved,,,

just like with college tuition they know its a guaranteed check so they bump the price

Thé Government is not regulating enough

See the price of prescriptions vs countries with strict regulations?

Hello? McFly? Tuition prices were normal until the government stepped in to "help".
Then came relaxed admission standards, inflated tuition and book prices, and more cushy administrative jobs because hey, Uncle Sugar will pick up the tab. It's fucking sickening.

To think the exact same thing would not happen with medical care is folly.

Bull shit

Prescription prices were affordable until Big Pharm bought out our Congress

What are Nancy and the dems in the House doing to reduce drug costs? Thanks for playing.

"(Reuters) - The cost of insulin for treating type 1 diabetes in the United States nearly doubled over a five-year period, underscoring a national outcry over rising drug prices, according to a new analysis shared with Reuters. A person with type 1 diabetes incurred annual insulin costs of $5,705, on average, in 2016."
U.S. insulin costs per patient nearly doubled from 2012 to 2016: study - Reuters

CVS cuts cost for generic EpiPen competitor
The drugstore chain announced Thursday that it will sell a generic version of Impax Laboratories (IPXL)' Adrenaclick treatment for $109.99 per two-pack, down from $200. The drug company Mylan drew the ire of customers and Congress when it raised the price to more than $600 for an EpiPen two-pack.

its not their job to do anything about the price of anything,,,

 

[progressive hunter]

its enough,,,

what proof do you have that prices will go down or that care will get better???

because all the facts we have says it wont,,,

It tells me you base your theory on very little.

compared to what you base it on its a whole lot,,,

all you have is opinion absent of facts and reality

There are lots of examples of single payer systems with much lower costs...

and yet you post none of them,,,

and cost is irrelevant to quality and freedom of choice,,,

I believe it is all of them. Our system really expensive. Insurance limits our choice all the time. In network?

well its a private business and completely voluntary,,,,
not so much with a socialist system

you dont like it move

 

[progressive hunter]

Yes because of government interference, when I was making 12 an hour 20 years ago I had the best insurance plan for 30 bucks a week. Fast forward to today. It’s out of control. Thanks to the government

Government keeps getting involved as it gets more expensive.

you have that backwards,,,it keeps getting more expensive because the government is involved,,,

just like with college tuition they know its a guaranteed check so they bump the price

Thé Government is not regulating enough

See the price of prescriptions vs countries with strict regulations?

Hello? McFly? Tuition prices were normal until the government stepped in to "help".
Then came relaxed admission standards, inflated tuition and book prices, and more cushy administrative jobs because hey, Uncle Sugar will pick up the tab. It's fucking sickening.

To think the exact same thing would not happen with medical care is folly.

Bull shit

Prescription prices were affordable until Big Pharm bought out our Congress

then fix that problem,,,and dont make more problems,,,

and that congress is who you dems and repubes voted for,,,so its your fault not mine,,,,

 

[progressive hunter]

b

Several.

First of all, people need to be getting their health insurance individually, the way they buy every other insurance they use, rather than being dependent on an employer to decide which plan is going to be offered and how much it's going to cost them. This would require several things.

1) Allow health insurance to be sold across state lines to increase competition.
2) Allow insurance companies more scope to tailor policies and coverage to what their customers want to buy.
3) Give individual purchasers the same sort of tax breaks on their insurance that employers currently enjoy.
4) Allow customers to form their own associations through which to buy insurance and get discounts available for larger customer pools.

Second of all, the patients need to also be the customers when it comes to using healthcare. Rather than mandating expansion of EVERY policy to cover EVERY possible use of medical care, we need to expand the use and availability of HSA and flexible spending accounts. Instead of sending premiums to an insurance company every paycheck, that money goes into an account pre-tax, and waits there for you to use it. And then when you need to visit a doctor, YOU see the prices, YOU decide what to spend and where. Prices for medical care will become lower and less obscure when doctors aren't having to figure out how to get around a bunch of bean-counters and algorithms at some insurance company.

How does any of this address the matter of your health insurance/healthcare being tied to being employed and/or your employment?

being tied to the employer is what makes it cheaper because they bring large groups to the market,,,

 

[rightwinger]

Government keeps getting involved as it gets more expensive.

you have that backwards,,,it keeps getting more expensive because the government is involved,,,

just like with college tuition they know its a guaranteed check so they bump the price

Thé Government is not regulating enough

See the price of prescriptions vs countries with strict regulations?

Hello? McFly? Tuition prices were normal until the government stepped in to "help".
Then came relaxed admission standards, inflated tuition and book prices, and more cushy administrative jobs because hey, Uncle Sugar will pick up the tab. It's fucking sickening.

To think the exact same thing would not happen with medical care is folly.

Bull shit

Prescription prices were affordable until Big Pharm bought out our Congress

Yeah...and-?

?

 

[rightwinger]

b

Several.

First of all, people need to be getting their health insurance individually, the way they buy every other insurance they use, rather than being dependent on an employer to decide which plan is going to be offered and how much it's going to cost them. This would require several things.

1) Allow health insurance to be sold across state lines to increase competition.
2) Allow insurance companies more scope to tailor policies and coverage to what their customers want to buy.
3) Give individual purchasers the same sort of tax breaks on their insurance that employers currently enjoy.
4) Allow customers to form their own associations through which to buy insurance and get discounts available for larger customer pools.

Second of all, the patients need to also be the customers when it comes to using healthcare. Rather than mandating expansion of EVERY policy to cover EVERY possible use of medical care, we need to expand the use and availability of HSA and flexible spending accounts. Instead of sending premiums to an insurance company every paycheck, that money goes into an account pre-tax, and waits there for you to use it. And then when you need to visit a doctor, YOU see the prices, YOU decide what to spend and where. Prices for medical care will become lower and less obscure when doctors aren't having to figure out how to get around a bunch of bean-counters and algorithms at some insurance company.

How does any of this address the matter of your health insurance/healthcare being tied to being employed and/or your employment?

being tied to the employer is what makes it cheaper because they bring large groups to the market,,,

Employers don’t want the responsibility of healthcare
It is not their job

 

[progressive hunter]

b

Several.

First of all, people need to be getting their health insurance individually, the way they buy every other insurance they use, rather than being dependent on an employer to decide which plan is going to be offered and how much it's going to cost them. This would require several things.

1) Allow health insurance to be sold across state lines to increase competition.
2) Allow insurance companies more scope to tailor policies and coverage to what their customers want to buy.
3) Give individual purchasers the same sort of tax breaks on their insurance that employers currently enjoy.
4) Allow customers to form their own associations through which to buy insurance and get discounts available for larger customer pools.

Second of all, the patients need to also be the customers when it comes to using healthcare. Rather than mandating expansion of EVERY policy to cover EVERY possible use of medical care, we need to expand the use and availability of HSA and flexible spending accounts. Instead of sending premiums to an insurance company every paycheck, that money goes into an account pre-tax, and waits there for you to use it. And then when you need to visit a doctor, YOU see the prices, YOU decide what to spend and where. Prices for medical care will become lower and less obscure when doctors aren't having to figure out how to get around a bunch of bean-counters and algorithms at some insurance company.

How does any of this address the matter of your health insurance/healthcare being tied to being employed and/or your employment?

being tied to the employer is what makes it cheaper because they bring large groups to the market,,,

Employers don’t want the responsibility of healthcare
It is not their job

who are you to speak for millions of people you dont know and have never met???

everyone of my employers were happy to provide it,,,and its an add on to get better employees,,,

 

[Cecilie1200]

Government is the reason health "care" (insurance) prices are inflated right now. Get them out of there and premiums fall.

Also, Medicare needs leaned out. All them commercials all the time trying to exploit loopholes in Medicare to sell people stuff they don't need.

Premiums will fall but will the quality of care also fall? Will it be a race to the bottom?

What I've mostly seen on TV are prescription drug commercials. Are they advertising to doctors or patients? The goal is obviously to increase sales in a free market but does that make for better healthcare outcomes?

Why do you think quality of care would fall if the government wasn't involved? In what other area you can name has the government been synonymous with "Gold Standard: Best Quality Ever"?

Seems to me that if health insurance AND health care were required to focus their attention on the PATIENT as the customer, rather than government as the customer, it could only be an incentive to provide better care. After all, the patient cares far more about the quality of the care he receives than the government ever will.

Whether or not advertising leads to better healthcare outcomes depends on a lot of things. Obviously, it's better if patients are more informed about their own conditions and possible treatments, and if they actually communicate with their doctors about these things (as all the commercials encourage them to do). Unfortunately, people are sometimes immensely stupid, and a little knowledge becomes a dangerous thing.

 

[rightwinger]

b

Several.

First of all, people need to be getting their health insurance individually, the way they buy every other insurance they use, rather than being dependent on an employer to decide which plan is going to be offered and how much it's going to cost them. This would require several things.

1) Allow health insurance to be sold across state lines to increase competition.
2) Allow insurance companies more scope to tailor policies and coverage to what their customers want to buy.
3) Give individual purchasers the same sort of tax breaks on their insurance that employers currently enjoy.
4) Allow customers to form their own associations through which to buy insurance and get discounts available for larger customer pools.

Second of all, the patients need to also be the customers when it comes to using healthcare. Rather than mandating expansion of EVERY policy to cover EVERY possible use of medical care, we need to expand the use and availability of HSA and flexible spending accounts. Instead of sending premiums to an insurance company every paycheck, that money goes into an account pre-tax, and waits there for you to use it. And then when you need to visit a doctor, YOU see the prices, YOU decide what to spend and where. Prices for medical care will become lower and less obscure when doctors aren't having to figure out how to get around a bunch of bean-counters and algorithms at some insurance company.

How does any of this address the matter of your health insurance/healthcare being tied to being employed and/or your employment?

being tied to the employer is what makes it cheaper because they bring large groups to the market,,,

Employers don’t want the responsibility of healthcare
It is not their job

who are you to speak for millions of people you dont know and have never met???

everyone of my employers were happy to provide it,,,and its an add on to get better employees,,,

Used to be

Now health insurance is something that pisses off your employees when premiums go up or benefits are cut

 

[progressive hunter]

b

Several.

First of all, people need to be getting their health insurance individually, the way they buy every other insurance they use, rather than being dependent on an employer to decide which plan is going to be offered and how much it's going to cost them. This would require several things.

1) Allow health insurance to be sold across state lines to increase competition.
2) Allow insurance companies more scope to tailor policies and coverage to what their customers want to buy.
3) Give individual purchasers the same sort of tax breaks on their insurance that employers currently enjoy.
4) Allow customers to form their own associations through which to buy insurance and get discounts available for larger customer pools.

Second of all, the patients need to also be the customers when it comes to using healthcare. Rather than mandating expansion of EVERY policy to cover EVERY possible use of medical care, we need to expand the use and availability of HSA and flexible spending accounts. Instead of sending premiums to an insurance company every paycheck, that money goes into an account pre-tax, and waits there for you to use it. And then when you need to visit a doctor, YOU see the prices, YOU decide what to spend and where. Prices for medical care will become lower and less obscure when doctors aren't having to figure out how to get around a bunch of bean-counters and algorithms at some insurance company.

How does any of this address the matter of your health insurance/healthcare being tied to being employed and/or your employment?

being tied to the employer is what makes it cheaper because they bring large groups to the market,,,

Employers don’t want the responsibility of healthcare
It is not their job

who are you to speak for millions of people you dont know and have never met???

everyone of my employers were happy to provide it,,,and its an add on to get better employees,,,

Used to be

Now health insurance is something that pisses off your employees when premiums go up or benefits are cut

AND THAT IS BECAUSE THE GOVERNMENT FUCKED IT ALL UP,,,

 

[MarcATL]

being tied to the employer is what makes it cheaper because they bring large groups to the market,,,

So your answer is EFF 'em, right? No good job, no good health insurance, and no job at all, no health insurance at all eh?

That's why the system is broken, and why the Republican way is about to be completely dismantled.

You guys aren't honest brokers. You just aren't.

 

[progressive hunter]

being tied to the employer is what makes it cheaper because they bring large groups to the market,,,

So your answer is EFF 'em, right? No good job, no good health insurance, and no job at all, no health insurance at all eh?

That's why the system is broken, and why the Republican way is about to be completely dismantled.

You guys aren't honest brokers. You just aren't.

if that made sense I would respond with something more than a dumb look,,,

 

[Cecilie1200]

Is housing and food a right too? They're both necessary for life.

I don't think they are the same since you can't work for your housing and food if you're not healthy enough to work.

You can't be healthy enough to do ANYTHING - including live - if you don't have food and shelter, Einstein.

 

[kyzr]

you have that backwards,,,it keeps getting more expensive because the government is involved,,,

just like with college tuition they know its a guaranteed check so they bump the price

Thé Government is not regulating enough

See the price of prescriptions vs countries with strict regulations?

Hello? McFly? Tuition prices were normal until the government stepped in to "help".
Then came relaxed admission standards, inflated tuition and book prices, and more cushy administrative jobs because hey, Uncle Sugar will pick up the tab. It's fucking sickening.

To think the exact same thing would not happen with medical care is folly.

Bull shit

Prescription prices were affordable until Big Pharm bought out our Congress

What are Nancy and the dems in the House doing to reduce drug costs? Thanks for playing.

"(Reuters) - The cost of insulin for treating type 1 diabetes in the United States nearly doubled over a five-year period, underscoring a national outcry over rising drug prices, according to a new analysis shared with Reuters. A person with type 1 diabetes incurred annual insulin costs of $5,705, on average, in 2016."
U.S. insulin costs per patient nearly doubled from 2012 to 2016: study - Reuters

CVS cuts cost for generic EpiPen competitor
The drugstore chain announced Thursday that it will sell a generic version of Impax Laboratories (IPXL)' Adrenaclick treatment for $109.99 per two-pack, down from $200. The drug company Mylan drew the ire of customers and Congress when it raised the price to more than $600 for an EpiPen two-pack.

its not their job to do anything about the price of anything,,,

What is their job exactly? To get bribed to make laws to make corporations money?

 

[rightwinger]

b

How does any of this address the matter of your health insurance/healthcare being tied to being employed and/or your employment?

being tied to the employer is what makes it cheaper because they bring large groups to the market,,,

Employers don’t want the responsibility of healthcare
It is not their job

who are you to speak for millions of people you dont know and have never met???

everyone of my employers were happy to provide it,,,and its an add on to get better employees,,,

Used to be

Now health insurance is something that pisses off your employees when premiums go up or benefits are cut

AND THAT IS BECAUSE THE GOVERNMENT FUCKED IT ALL UP,,,

How so?

 

[Cellblock2429]

b
being tied to the employer is what makes it cheaper because they bring large groups to the market,,,

Employers don’t want the responsibility of healthcare
It is not their job

who are you to speak for millions of people you dont know and have never met???

everyone of my employers were happy to provide it,,,and its an add on to get better employees,,,

Used to be

Now health insurance is something that pisses off your employees when premiums go up or benefits are cut

AND THAT IS BECAUSE THE GOVERNMENT FUCKED IT ALL UP,,,

How so?

/—-/ Ever hear of the VA?

 

[Esmeralda]

You people prefer to let the rich get richer and the poor die from lack of proper healthcare benefits.

No, we prefer to have FREEDOM of choice, and not be dictated to for everything by an overbearing, tyrannical government. Something you people have put up with for centuries. Anybody can walk into a U.S. hospital and get healthcare if they need it. If they can't afford to pay they are NOT CHARGED anything,

Nobody is dying in the streets unless they are drug users, crazy, etc.

Choosing universal healthcare for this country is a freedom, and it will come to be: the voters will choose it.

I think our healthcare system needs an overhaul. Obamacare did huge damage to it. However, a government run system is not the answer. Universal healthcare will neither be affordable, nor sustainable in a country of 330 million and growing with ILLEGALS and people that don't pay into it. We are not Canada, nor the UK. We are different, have different social pressures, and need a different, market based, competitive and efficient solution.

Yada, yada, yada, yada....same old ignorant BS. Medicare works for millions of Americans. Medicare for all will work for the entire country. Stop being negative and looking backwards. Look forward.

The people on Medicare paid for it all their working lives.
Having Medicare for all will bankrupt it sooner. Medicare is going bankrupt by 2026
Medicare Will Be Insolvent by 2026—Can America Fix It in Time?
and that is just with the people over 65 who earned it. Adding freeloaders will kill Medicare for everyone.
Looking forward, if you want healthcare work for it and pay for it.

No. People who are retired paid for social security. We pay as much for medical expenses now as we would pay for Medicare for all. It comes directly out of your pocket now; the same amount or less would pay for it through taxes. If the wealthy and big corporations pay their fair share of taxes, it would pay for Medicare for all and more. Also, we need to stop giving doctors and the drug companies exorbitant amounts of money. You need some vision to see that it would work. Doctors from other countries come here in order to become wealthy: not because they are the best doctors in the world but because they can make a lot more money here instead in countries that have universal healthcare.