Question from a non-American. Do you guys really hate each other?

[BluesLegend]

I am not American but I do find American politics to be quite interesting

Let met straighten out your shit. Its not Dem vs Rep its pro big Government and their government mooching dependents vs the free working people they want to enslave to pay for their government utopia.

and both parties are for bigger government

You got that 100% right. And its not just at the Federal level, working taxpayers vs big government and their moochers, wars are being fought at the state and local level also.

 

[pismoe]

I am not American but I do find American politics to be quite interesting in a sort of soap opera sort of way but one thing I really don't get is in America, unlike my own country (Australia) there seems to be a genuine hatred between the left and right, as in both would love to completely destroy the other and pretty much hate everything that the other side stands for.

I know my country the left wing party (Labor) and the right wing party (Liberals) are not too far away from each other politically, and while there is a lot of animosity there is not really any hatred. In America though I get the impression that the Republicans would have welcomed a recession when Obama was in charge as that way he would have been blamed, and Democrats would welcome a market crash now because he would be blamed, it seemingly not mattering that your country would be falling down a toilet, as long as the other side gets the blame for it.

Admittedly I don't know the politics of every fully Democratic nation, that would be impossible, but as far as I know America is quite unique in just how much both sides hate each other.

My question is do both sides genuinely hate each other, would each side be happy to see America burn if they could blame the other side, and if this is the case?

I also must admit that the differences between the US states is quite amazing. I go from one state in my own country to another, and basically they are the same, more or less anyway, but in America I get the feeling that New York and California are so different to Texas and Alabama that they may as well be in different countries in terms of beliefs and general ideology on almost every issue. I find it amazing that these states are in the same country as it almost feels as convoluted as the Austro-Hungarian empire, with dozens of different ethnic groups within the one country, all wanting very different things and none of them feeling that united.

So my general question is how divided is America, is it so divided that one side of politics would love to see America enter a deep depression just so the other political party could be blamed for it, and if so is that a healthy situation to be in?

Not that I am advocating for it, but with the massive differences between the red and the blue states America from an outsiders point of view seems like it is in a very unhappy marriage where both parties are staying together for the sake of the children, but end up fighting a lot in front of the children and making them cry so I wonder, if what I am saying is remotely accurate why isn't there more talk about an amicable divorce, where the blue states go their own way and the red states go another, where both sides can go the direction they want to go and seemingly not being held back by the other side.

I mean, do the people of Alabama really care that much about the people of New York, or vice-versa? Also is politics and America in general as divided as I have made out, or is America more like siblings who hate each other and will kick the crap out of each other but deep down love each other as well, even though they would never admit it?

I don't like saying it, but I do think our ends of the spectrum really do hate each other.

Ironically, they share many behaviors, and that probably makes them even more angry.

Personal insults, name-calling, hyperbole, distortion, straw man arguments, tribalism, denial. It's all the same stuff.

Imagine going through life, being so similar in behaviors to those you loathe.
.

Much of this hatred and distortion is the result of right wing talk radio's villainization, distortions and outright lies about liberals and liberal policy. There is no liberal equivalent to people like Glenn Beck or Rush Limbaugh, who spout lies and hate toward the right, in the same manner, on a 24/7 basis throughout vast swathes of the country.

We see a lot of the result of this campaign of lies and hate, here, every single day: Things like "Liberals are a plague and should be wiped out for the good of the nation". The characterization of women's rights advocates as "feminazis", and other vicious attacks on any minority that dares stand up for their rights or suggests that their constituency is not getting a fair shake - organizations like "Black Lives Matter".

Lies like "George Soros is the puppetmaster behind the liberal movement in America". No he's not. Soros pretty much donates to organizations he thinks are doing good, and takes no active role in their operation - like Planned Parenthood.

But a lot of that is being posted by Russian trolls. Anyone amassing 10,000 posts per year while claiming to be a 50 something small business owner, is a Russian troll. I'm a retired pensioner and I don't have time to post 10,000 times a year. And during the busy Christmas season, I about stopped posting altogether, trying to fill orders. How can these men run successful businesses and still post 40 times a day?

----------------------------------------- course the lefty , dem , liberals approve of and advocate abortion and advocate Gun Control and immigration of third worlders into the USA so those 3 lefty goals alone are enough reasons for me and other Americans to view the lefty dem liberals as enemies . And conservative radio is fine , informative and interesting 'Run' . By the way , I think that DragonLady is a 'canadian' so she shouldn't be taken seriously 'Run' .

the republicans just gave 500 million to pay for abortions, they also are the latest to impose gun control, and they are also bringing in 3rd world despots daily


both parties are the same except for speed of destruction

---------------------------------------Agree , and whats to be done eh ?? As a 70 year old Deplorable I voted for repub Trump . And GOA is fighting the bump stock ban so send them a hundred bucks .--------------------- and repubs ' Reagan - bush ' started with amnesty . So yep 'PH'

 

[AntonToo]

My question is do both sides genuinely hate each other, would each side be happy to see America burn if they could blame the other side, and if this is the case?

No thats, not the case.

Sure there are some extremists out there, but even among partisan politicos (who themselves are a minority of Americans) hate is not the word they would use to describe their feelings for the opposition.

Wrong? Of course
Adversarial IN POLITICS? Yes
Ignorant or arrogant? Yea

But few actually think of the other side as an outright enemy.

 

[80zephyr]

Yes, it has come down to hate

Our political system used to rely on compromise. I’ll give a little, you give a little and we will meet somewhere in the middle

Now a win/win solution can’t be tolerated because it allows the other side to win also

Thats a lie. The only compromise was from the right. The left got their wishes, from abortion to welfare, to gay marriage to divorce. And when the right finally said "enough", the left called us Nazi's.

Prove me wrong. Give me a list of the "compromises" the right has won over the years.

Mark

 

[pismoe]

My question is do both sides genuinely hate each other, would each side be happy to see America burn if they could blame the other side, and if this is the case?

No thats, not the case.

Sure there are some extremists out there, but even among partisan politicos (who themselves are a minority of Americans) hate is not the word they would use to describe their feelings for the opposition.

Wrong? Of course
Adverserial? Yes
Ignorant or arrogant? Yea

But few acutally think of the other side as an outright enemy.

---------------------------------------- well then they'd be stupid AntonToo . And with a name like AntonToo , what country are you from AntoToo .

 

[AntonToo]

My question is do both sides genuinely hate each other, would each side be happy to see America burn if they could blame the other side, and if this is the case?

No thats, not the case.

Sure there are some extremists out there, but even among partisan politicos (who themselves are a minority of Americans) hate is not the word they would use to describe their feelings for the opposition.

Wrong? Of course
Adverserial? Yes
Ignorant or arrogant? Yea

But few acutally think of the other side as an outright enemy.

---------------------------------------- well then they'd be stupid AntonToo . And with a name like AntonToo , what country are you from AntoToo .

Good talk smart guy, gives me much to think about.

I am from America. Hi.

 

[Pilot1]

I am from America. Hi.

SOUTH AMERICA?

 

[Olde Europe]

But a lot of that is being posted by Russian trolls. Anyone amassing 10,000 posts per year while claiming to be a 50 something small business owner, is a Russian troll. I'm a retired pensioner and I don't have time to post 10,000 times a year. And during the busy Christmas season, I about stopped posting altogether, trying to fill orders. How can these men run successful businesses and still post 40 times a day?

With all due respect, Dragonlady, you should not make that accusation ("Russian trolls") unless you have clear evidence to support it. I am sure "false testimony" rings a bell with you. Moreover, in case you drop the requirement to conceive of, and formulate, a proper argument, and reduce most postings to insulting, unthinking one-liners and well-rehearsed and oft-repeated blab (I hope you won't), you, too, can blast off 40 postings a day, or even double that, as that takes just seconds for each posting. So, the number of postings proves nothing at all.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

Do you guys really hate each other?

Yeah, pretty much.

Two groups are competing to fuck us all out of different individual rights. It stirs up a lot of hate.

 

[Ambivalent1]

I am not American but I do find American politics to be quite interesting in a sort of soap opera sort of way but one thing I really don't get is in America, unlike my own country (Australia) there seems to be a genuine hatred between the left and right, as in both would love to completely destroy the other and pretty much hate everything that the other side stands for.

I know my country the left wing party (Labor) and the right wing party (Liberals) are not too far away from each other politically, and while there is a lot of animosity there is not really any hatred. In America though I get the impression that the Republicans would have welcomed a recession when Obama was in charge as that way he would have been blamed, and Democrats would welcome a market crash now because he would be blamed, it seemingly not mattering that your country would be falling down a toilet, as long as the other side gets the blame for it.

Admittedly I don't know the politics of every fully Democratic nation, that would be impossible, but as far as I know America is quite unique in just how much both sides hate each other.

My question is do both sides genuinely hate each other, would each side be happy to see America burn if they could blame the other side, and if this is the case?

I also must admit that the differences between the US states is quite amazing. I go from one state in my own country to another, and basically they are the same, more or less anyway, but in America I get the feeling that New York and California are so different to Texas and Alabama that they may as well be in different countries in terms of beliefs and general ideology on almost every issue. I find it amazing that these states are in the same country as it almost feels as convoluted as the Austro-Hungarian empire, with dozens of different ethnic groups within the one country, all wanting very different things and none of them feeling that united.

So my general question is how divided is America, is it so divided that one side of politics would love to see America enter a deep depression just so the other political party could be blamed for it, and if so is that a healthy situation to be in?

Not that I am advocating for it, but with the massive differences between the red and the blue states America from an outsiders point of view seems like it is in a very unhappy marriage where both parties are staying together for the sake of the children, but end up fighting a lot in front of the children and making them cry so I wonder, if what I am saying is remotely accurate why isn't there more talk about an amicable divorce, where the blue states go their own way and the red states go another, where both sides can go the direction they want to go and seemingly not being held back by the other side.

I mean, do the people of Alabama really care that much about the people of New York, or vice-versa? Also is politics and America in general as divided as I have made out, or is America more like siblings who hate each other and will kick the crap out of each other but deep down love each other as well, even though they would never admit it?

I don't like saying it, but I do think our ends of the spectrum really do hate each other.

Ironically, they share many behaviors, and that probably makes them even more angry.

Personal insults, name-calling, hyperbole, distortion, straw man arguments, tribalism, denial. It's all the same stuff.

Imagine going through life, being so similar in behaviors to those you loathe.
.

Much of this hatred and distortion is the result of right wing talk radio's villainization, distortions and outright lies about liberals and liberal policy. There is no liberal equivalent to people like Glenn Beck or Rush Limbaugh, who spout lies and hate toward the right, in the same manner, on a 24/7 basis throughout vast swathes of the country.

We see a lot of the result of this campaign of lies and hate, here, every single day: Things like "Liberals are a plague and should be wiped out for the good of the nation". The characterization of women's rights advocates as "feminazis", and other vicious attacks on any minority that dares stand up for their rights or suggests that their constituency is not getting a fair shake - organizations like "Black Lives Matter".

Lies like "George Soros is the puppetmaster behind the liberal movement in America". No he's not. Soros pretty much donates to organizations he thinks are doing good, and takes no active role in their operation - like Planned Parenthood.

But a lot of that is being posted by Russian trolls. Anyone amassing 10,000 posts per year while claiming to be a 50 something small business owner, is a Russian troll. I'm a retired pensioner and I don't have time to post 10,000 times a year. And during the busy Christmas season, I about stopped posting altogether, trying to fill orders. How can these men run successful businesses and still post 40 times a day?

You seem to see a Rooskie behind every rock.

 

[Lysistrata]

I don't think that there is as much hatred among normal Americans as might appear.

However, the rise of fringe movements among certain demographic groups who identify only with their particular group, have a tremendous and unearned sense of entitlement, and refuse to mix with their fellow Americans unless they automatically are given the captain's hat have hurt this nation terribly.

These fringe groups have been fueled by irresponsible talk-show hosts who make a fortune insulting groups of Americans they don't like, and the availability of the internet to help unite these bozos, to the extent that voices of moderation have been drowned out.by automatically being labeled as extremists from "the other side" by the spokepersons for these groups. Even a mild assertion that we should live peacefully together, help each other, and maintain our institutions and public services in a neutral manner gets one called names as if this assertion is somehow extremist. Even the mere mention of the words "justice" or "equality" gets one jumped on by these fringe groups, who are now directing the narrative, even though the values these words represent are universal. They mock people with concerns for the proper delivery of justice or for the welfare of their fellows as singing "Kumbaya."

These fringe groups have come up with the totally ridiculous concept that some Americans are "real Americans" and others are not. Talk about deliberately divisive.

It has been heartening to see the throngs of Americans willing to come out from coast to coast to oppose this sort of garbage and take back our country from the lunatic fringe.

I love your song I Am, You Are, We Are Australian and the beautiful video that accompanies it. I hope that someday we can sing I am, You Are, We Are American.

 

[DigitalDrifter]

Yes, we, the left and the right do indeed hate each other. We are hopelessly divided.

I for one hate the American leftwing.

 

[AntonToo]

I am from America. Hi.

SOUTH AMERICA?

Wtf is wrong with you idiots? America America. United States.

 

[AntonToo]

Yes, it has come down to hate

Our political system used to rely on compromise. I’ll give a little, you give a little and we will meet somewhere in the middle

Now a win/win solution can’t be tolerated because it allows the other side to win also

Thats a lie. The only compromise was from the right. The left got their wishes, from abortion to welfare, to gay marriage to divorce. And when the right finally said "enough", the left called us Nazi's.

Prove me wrong. Give me a list of the "compromises" the right has won over the years.

Mark

Abortion rights are limited, access is very limited in a lot of red states - thats a compromise for the left.

Taxes are historically way down - thats a compromise for the left.

No public option or single payer in healthcare - thats a compromise for the left.

Higher education tuition is still expensive - thats a compromise for the left.

Minimum wage is way down in real terms since the 60's - thats a compromise for the left.

Shall I go on?

 

[The Original Tree]

All you have to do is look at what the Left did to Roy Moore, Kavanaugh and President Trump. Nothing is sacred. Due Process does not come in to play, and a mere accusation is proof of guilt even if it is a false one.

The Left hates the Right, but The Right doesn't hate them back. We just dislike and abhor their dangerous politics and ideologies.

 

[AntonToo]

All you have to do is look at what the Left did to Roy Moore, Kavanaugh and President Trump.

...one is a Supreme Court Judge.
The other is the President of the United States
And the third guy is enjoying "early" retirement at 72.

Nothing happened to them that didn't happen to high profile Democrats like Clintons or Pelosi.

 

[80zephyr]

Yes, it has come down to hate

Our political system used to rely on compromise. I’ll give a little, you give a little and we will meet somewhere in the middle

Now a win/win solution can’t be tolerated because it allows the other side to win also

Thats a lie. The only compromise was from the right. The left got their wishes, from abortion to welfare, to gay marriage to divorce. And when the right finally said "enough", the left called us Nazi's.

Prove me wrong. Give me a list of the "compromises" the right has won over the years.

Mark

Abortion rights are limited, access is very limited in a lot of red states - thats a compromise for the left.

Taxes are historically way down - thats a compromise for the left.

No public option or single payer in healthcare - thats a compromise for the left.

Higher education tuition is still expensive - thats a compromise for the left.

Minimum wage is way down in real terms since the 60's - thats a compromise for the left.

Shall I go on?

Yes, because those are not something you compromised with the right on. You act like conservatives WANT high tuition. Just the existence of a minimum wage is a liberal win. As is Obamacare.

You are arguing degrees of change, not policy changes.

Mark

 

[80zephyr]

Yes, it has come down to hate

Our political system used to rely on compromise. I’ll give a little, you give a little and we will meet somewhere in the middle

Now a win/win solution can’t be tolerated because it allows the other side to win also

Thats a lie. The only compromise was from the right. The left got their wishes, from abortion to welfare, to gay marriage to divorce. And when the right finally said "enough", the left called us Nazi's.

Prove me wrong. Give me a list of the "compromises" the right has won over the years.

Mark

Abortion rights are limited, access is very limited in a lot of red states - thats a compromise for the left.

Taxes are historically way down - thats a compromise for the left.

No public option or single payer in healthcare - thats a compromise for the left.

Higher education tuition is still expensive - thats a compromise for the left.

Minimum wage is way down in real terms since the 60's - thats a compromise for the left.

Shall I go on?

Yes, because those are not something you compromised with the right on. You act like conservatives WANT high tuition. Just the existence of a minimum wage is a liberal win. As is Obamacare.

You are arguing degrees of change, not policy changes.

The only place where the left is losing is on guns, and thats it.

Mark

 

[AntonToo]

Yes, it has come down to hate

Our political system used to rely on compromise. I’ll give a little, you give a little and we will meet somewhere in the middle

Now a win/win solution can’t be tolerated because it allows the other side to win also

Thats a lie. The only compromise was from the right. The left got their wishes, from abortion to welfare, to gay marriage to divorce. And when the right finally said "enough", the left called us Nazi's.

Prove me wrong. Give me a list of the "compromises" the right has won over the years.

Mark

Abortion rights are limited, access is very limited in a lot of red states - thats a compromise for the left.

Taxes are historically way down - thats a compromise for the left.

No public option or single payer in healthcare - thats a compromise for the left.

Higher education tuition is still expensive - thats a compromise for the left.

Minimum wage is way down in real terms since the 60's - thats a compromise for the left.

Shall I go on?

Yes, because those are not something you compromised with the right on. You act like conservatives WANT high tuition. Just the existence of a minimum wage is a liberal win. As is Obamacare.

You are arguing degrees of change, not policy changes.

Mark

High taxes vs Low taxes is a question of degree.

Between abortion being available on demand and abortion being illegal there are degrees.

Between federal governement subsidizing all education and Federal government not subsidizing any education there are degrees. Conservatives may not want high tution, but they sure as hell don't want Federal government helping people afford it.

Low minimum wage and high minimum wage is a matter of degree.

Medicare being available to some, or all - is a matter of degree.

So your binary thinking is wrong, policy change primarily happens in degrees - it is very important and absolutely there are many areas where liberals are not getting what they want just as there are many areas where conservatives do not get what they want.

 

[80zephyr]

Yes, it has come down to hate

Our political system used to rely on compromise. I’ll give a little, you give a little and we will meet somewhere in the middle

Now a win/win solution can’t be tolerated because it allows the other side to win also

Thats a lie. The only compromise was from the right. The left got their wishes, from abortion to welfare, to gay marriage to divorce. And when the right finally said "enough", the left called us Nazi's.

Prove me wrong. Give me a list of the "compromises" the right has won over the years.

Mark

Abortion rights are limited, access is very limited in a lot of red states - thats a compromise for the left.

Taxes are historically way down - thats a compromise for the left.

No public option or single payer in healthcare - thats a compromise for the left.

Higher education tuition is still expensive - thats a compromise for the left.

Minimum wage is way down in real terms since the 60's - thats a compromise for the left.

Shall I go on?

Yes, because those are not something you compromised with the right on. You act like conservatives WANT high tuition. Just the existence of a minimum wage is a liberal win. As is Obamacare.

You are arguing degrees of change, not policy changes.

Mark

High taxes vs Low taxes is a question of degree.

Between abortion being available on demand and abortion being illegal there are degrees.

Between federal governement subsidizing all education and Federal government not subsidizing any education there are degrees.

Low minimum wage and high minimum wage is a matter of degree.

Medicare being available to some, or all - is a matter of degree.


So your binary thinking is wrong, policy change primarily happens in degrees - it is very important and absolutely there are many areas where liberals are not getting what they want just as there are many areas where conservatives do not get what they want.

Nope. The push back is a "carving out" of requirements to pursue an activity. Is not abortion the law of the land? Or gay marriage? How about welfare? Medicare? Social Security?

What the right is doing is fighting the left to maintain some of the control that the right "compromised" on.

Your turn.

Mark