Shrink the Rich; Not Government

[daveman]

The top earners pay 70% of of the taxes...but you will hear the left with this little ditty.

Warren Buffets secretary pays more in taxes them Warren Buffet.....and they have a big smile of their face like take that you rightwinger....

They really believe that the secretary pays more in taxes.

The Secretary pays at a higher rate on less income....Buffet pays a lower rate on a tremendous amount of income....use your brains for once please.

Facts and logic trump their emotionalism every time.

Buffet pays a lower rate, does he still pay more taxes than his secretary? Genius.

Yes, of course he does, by several orders of magnitude. However, the greedy envious are pissed because he refuses to give any of his stuff to them. They want the government to take it away from him and redistribute it.

 

[georgephillip]

The rich may get a lower tax rate but they are taxed on a higher income..there's a good portion of this country that don't pay any taxes.Want fair then how about EVERYONE pays taxes.

Which is EXACTLY what would happen if we went to the 7-7 on 3 method of taxation.

A general sales tax of 7% on all purchases, both personal and commercial, combined with an income tax of 7% on personal income in excess of $3 million per year. Call it a "Winners Tax".

No corporate income tax. No personal income tax on the first $3 million.

Buy a Ferrari, pay Ferrari tax - buy a 7 year old Ford Fiesta, pay less. (Unless of course, you're stupid enough to pay $135,000 for a 7 year old Ford Fiesta)

Need pens, paper or a copy machine for your business? Pay 7% on the invoice but your business keeps all the income you can generate with those tools and supplies.

No loopholes, no bullshit, no IRS bureaucracy to pay for.

Your 7-7 on 3 method sounds like an improvement over our current system. I would suggest adding significant criminal penalties for millionaires engaging in tax fraud.

How about 1-Strike?

The first conviction for tax fraud results in spending 25 years in a blue-collar prison BEFORE the first parole hearing?

 

[MikeK]

[...]

I fail to see why they're so wrapped around the axle about the rich when many of them are rich themselves or have never been poor. Skipping meals is not starvation. Try going a week without eating like I have. That will open your eyes for sure.

[...]

Rich is a relative term. But you've piqued my curiosity with the above declaration.

I've heard stories about the Great Depression from those who lived through it, such as having oatmeal on Thanksgiving and getting up at 4AM on winter mornings to get on a bread line, and more. But I would like you to tell us what circumstances caused you to not eat for a week.

 

[georgephillip]

Health and Human Services 2011 Budget:

911 BBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBillion


Fuck, you are right, that is definitely not enough.

.

How do you feel about the 13 trillion dollar taxpayer bail-out of Wall Street's gambling losses?

I was 1000% opposed to it.

But remember , it was the progressives - the fascists - who using the Commerce clause as a pretext - created precedents by intervening in the national economy.

Will your feelings change next spring if WikiLeaks sends Bank of America into the same sewer Enron disappeared into?

Bank of America should have been allowed to go belly up.

.

Can you supply an example of a progressive fascist?

For some, Fascism is difficult to situate on a left - right political axis; however, it's usually regarded as an extreme form of conservatism.

Are you aware of any corporate fascists who've used the commerce clause to advance their interests in the national economy?

Whatever one's opinion on taxing individual income may be, corporations like GE have been manipulating the commerce clause for generations:

"GE has $36Bn in sales and paid $431M in taxes (15% of net profits) in 2009.

"They also paid out $9Bn in dividends and over $24Bn in 2008 and 2007 and in 2007 they bought back their own stock but, in those three years, they paid -(NEGATIVE) $900M in taxes!

"Does GE use our infrastructure?

"Do they use our public airwaves?

"Are they protected by our police?

"Is our army out there fighting and dying to protect them?

"Do they take money from our government?

"Do we educate their employees?

"This is the INSANITY of the US tax system.

Phil's Stock World

 

[AVG-JOE]

Are you aware of the fact that the 16th Amendment was sold to the populace as a soak the rich scam - where 95% of Americans were exempt?!?!?!?!?

Do you agree with the scheme?!?!?!?

Aware, yes.

Agree, no.

For a more detailed answer, see: http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...d-and-ask-again-three-times-start-a-poll.html

Especially this post: http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...n-three-times-start-a-poll-4.html#post3097760

Let me guess, you are a union dunce too.

Man, you are a terrible guesser! Don't ever try to do that for money.

 

[AVG-JOE]

But government is well on their way toward confiscation through lawful theft aren't they?

Would you call it "lawful theft" when Republicans AND Democrats write tax policy that allows someone earning a billion dollars per year to pay taxes at 15% while working and middle class taxpayers pay a rate of twice as much?

The top 10% of wage earners pay 70% of the taxes.

If that statistic is true you have 3 and only 3 options.

1. Leave things just the way they are.

2. Lower the taxes of the 10% who are overburdened.*

3. Increase the number of people who can afford to pay taxes by educating them on how to earn a living.​

* This is the easiest option for countries that have a little cash in the bank, but 21st Century America will find this one kind of tricky with the military and medicare obligations pushed through last decade.

 

[georgephillip]

Would you call it "lawful theft" when Republicans AND Democrats write tax policy that allows someone earning a billion dollars per year to pay taxes at 15% while working and middle class taxpayers pay a rate of twice as much?

The top 10% of wage earners pay 70% of the taxes.

The top earners pay 70% of of the taxes...but you will hear the left with this little ditty.

Warren Buffets secretary pays more in taxes them Warren Buffet.....and they have a big smile of their face like take that you rightwinger....

They really believe that the secretary pays more in taxes.

The Secretary pays at a higher rate on less income....Buffet pays a lower rate on a tremendous amount of income....use your brains for once please.

The top 10% of earners pay 70% of all Federal income taxes, NOT 70% of all taxes.

Saying the top 10% of wage earners pay 70% of all federal income taxes collected each year says absolutely nothing about the billions of dollars going uncollected from individual federal tax returns, and it says even less about corporate tax cheats.

Additionally, these figures don't discriminate between those earning $113,799/year and those earning $113,799,000/year.

"Average tax rates summarized in Table 1 range from 12.24% (all taxpayers) to 23.27% (top 1%). This doesn't mention that many of the v. Rich pay taxes based on capital gains (15%) as opposed income(23.27%)

The Tax Foundation

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Shrink the Rich; Not Government

Have you ever considered learning a marketable skill?

Have you ever considered that the Parasitism 101 that you leaned in the government owned and operated school is non productive.

.

What do you call 10,000 people "earning" 30% of total US income yet paying taxes at about half the rate as their secretaries and bodyguards?

And many of these richest 10,000 Americans attended private schools.

Personally I call it bullshit. The simple numbers tell me that the richest 5% of Americans pay over 60% of the taxes this country collects. You whining about imaginary numbers form a class war blog is a bit like the Democrats knocking Wall Street and writing laws that favor them, and bailing them out when they are in trouble. It actually makes me think you are being paid by the richest 25 to make false claims so they can get a better deal in Congress next year.

If you want anyone with a brain to take you seriously you need to deal with the facts.

- PD GRAPHICS: Interactive graphics, charts and more - cleveland.com

If you prefer to take the rdean route and blather fake numbers at everyone you are certainly free to do so, but the only people you will find that agree with you are the other idiots, and everyone else will just poke at you occasionally because they enjoy watching you repeat the same thing over and over.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Oh boo-hoo-hoo, the rich don't own everything yet!

Poor them.

They need still more and more and more to make up for their complete lack of humanity.

Wealthiest Americans pay bulk of federal income tax collected | cleveland.com

 

[daveman]

Would you call it "lawful theft" when Republicans AND Democrats write tax policy that allows someone earning a billion dollars per year to pay taxes at 15% while working and middle class taxpayers pay a rate of twice as much?

The top 10% of wage earners pay 70% of the taxes.

If that statistic is true you have 3 and only 3 options.

1. Leave things just the way they are.

2. Lower the taxes of the 10% who are overburdened.*

3. Increase the number of people who can afford to pay taxes by educating them on how to earn a living.​

* This is the easiest option for countries that have a little cash in the bank, but 21st Century America will find this one kind of tricky with the military and medicare obligations pushed through last decade.

I'm sure there are other options. I was just pointing out the idiocy of George's constant harping on the percentage meme.

 

[daveman]

The top 10% of wage earners pay 70% of the taxes.

The top earners pay 70% of of the taxes...but you will hear the left with this little ditty.

Warren Buffets secretary pays more in taxes them Warren Buffet.....and they have a big smile of their face like take that you rightwinger....

They really believe that the secretary pays more in taxes.

The Secretary pays at a higher rate on less income....Buffet pays a lower rate on a tremendous amount of income....use your brains for once please.

The top 10% of earners pay 70% of all Federal income taxes, NOT 70% of all taxes.

Saying the top 10% of wage earners pay 70% of all federal income taxes collected each year says absolutely nothing about the billions of dollars going uncollected from individual federal tax returns, and it says even less about corporate tax cheats.

Additionally, these figures don't discriminate between those earning $113,799/year and those earning $113,799,000/year.

"Average tax rates summarized in Table 1 range from 12.24% (all taxpayers) to 23.27% (top 1%). This doesn't mention that many of the v. Rich pay taxes based on capital gains (15%) as opposed income(23.27%)

The Tax Foundation

Oh, if ONLY those rich bastards would give you some of their money! THEN life will be fair!

 

[georgephillip]

Health and Human Services 2011 Budget:

911 BBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBillion


Fuck, you are right, that is definitely not enough.

.

How do you feel about the 13 trillion dollar taxpayer bail-out of Wall Street's gambling losses?

Will your feelings change next spring if WikiLeaks sends Bank of America into the same sewer Enron disappeared into?

How do you feel of the FED manipuating the Stock Market?

Federal Reserve Manipulating Stocks, Says Respected Expert

I think the Fed is the lynch pin in how the rich use government to socialize risk and privatize profit in this country, and it's not only stock fraud, T.

Housing and bond markets are also in play.

This from last June:

"Did the Federal Reserve collude with the big banks to hold millions of houses off the market until the Fed finished adding $1.25 trillion to the banks reserves?

"Did the Fed do this to make it appear that its bond purchasing plan (quantitative easing) was stabilizing prices when, in fact, it was the reduction in supply that stopped prices from plunging?

"It sure looks that way. This is from Bloomberg News:

"'U.S. home foreclosures reached a record for the second consecutive month in May, with increases in every state, as lenders stepped up property seizures, according to RealtyTrac.Inc.

“'Bank repossessions climbed 44 per cent from May 2009 to 93,777, the Irvine, California-based data company said today in a statement. Foreclosure filings, including default and auction notices, rose about 1 per cent to 322,920. One out of every 400 U.S. households received a filing.'" (Bloomberg)

The Next Housing Crisis

There appears to be an unholy trinity operating that involves the Fed, Treasury and the US Congress (including virtually all Republicans AND Democrats). Their goal is to transfer as much private debt onto the public sector as possible.

According to some this must result in a currency crisis at some point. At which time, the US dollar will no longer function as the world's reserve currency and our debt (and Empire) will become much more expensive for those of us who have not "off-shored" our wealth into "harder" currencies.

 

[georgephillip]

Facts and logic trump their emotionalism every time.

Buffet pays a lower rate, does he still pay more taxes than his secretary? Genius.

Yes, of course he does, by several orders of magnitude. However, the greedy envious are pissed because he refuses to give any of his stuff to them. They want the government to take it away from him and redistribute it.

Now tell us why Buffett and his ilk should not pay at least the same percentage of their income in taxes as their secretaries?

Hint: It has absolutely nothing to do with the percentage of total taxes that ARE being collected.

It has everything to do with taxes owed that are NOT being collected.

 

[hipeter924]

Buffet pays a lower rate, does he still pay more taxes than his secretary? Genius.

Yes, of course he does, by several orders of magnitude. However, the greedy envious are pissed because he refuses to give any of his stuff to them. They want the government to take it away from him and redistribute it.

Now tell us why Buffett and his ilk should not pay at least the same percentage of their income in taxes as their secretaries?

Hint: It has absolutely nothing to do with the percentage of total taxes that ARE being collected.

It has everything to do with taxes owed that are NOT being collected.

 

[The T]

Only way to settle ALL of this discussion is a FLAT or FAIR Tax. Abolishing the IRS and the punative tax code that is used these days as a political weapon in the persuit of buying votes by politicians it was designed for. The Founders never meant for incomes to be taxed. If they had we would have started out that way.

Wealth Envy is not pretty...nor constructive.

 

[georgephillip]

Have you ever considered learning a marketable skill?

Have you ever considered that the Parasitism 101 that you leaned in the government owned and operated school is non productive.

.

What do you call 10,000 people "earning" 30% of total US income yet paying taxes at about half the rate as their secretaries and bodyguards?

And many of these richest 10,000 Americans attended private schools.

Personally I call it bullshit. The simple numbers tell me that the richest 5% of Americans pay over 60% of the taxes this country collects. You whining about imaginary numbers form a class war blog is a bit like the Democrats knocking Wall Street and writing laws that favor them, and bailing them out when they are in trouble. It actually makes me think you are being paid by the richest 25 to make false claims so they can get a better deal in Congress next year.

If you want anyone with a brain to take you seriously you need to deal with the facts.

- PD GRAPHICS: Interactive graphics, charts and more - cleveland.com

If you prefer to take the rdean route and blather fake numbers at everyone you are certainly free to do so, but the only people you will find that agree with you are the other idiots, and everyone else will just poke at you occasionally because they enjoy watching you repeat the same thing over and over.

Your simple numbers tell you 5% of all Americans pay over 60% of all taxes collected in America.

They say nothing about taxes that are going uncollected.

For example, Warren Buffet famously pays taxes at a rate that's half what his secretary pays.

Which means half of Warren's tax liability is going uncollected every year. This means others have to pay Warren's share OR government has to cut services.

 

[georgephillip]

Only way to settle ALL of this discussion is a FLAT or FAIR Tax. Abolishing the IRS and the punative tax code that is used these days as a political weapon in the persuit of buying votes by politicians it was designed for. The Founders never meant for incomes to be taxed. If they had we would have started out that way.

Wealth Envy is not pretty...nor constructive.

The FLAT or FAIR tax could be viable if it also falls on Finance, Insurance and Real Estate, the so called FIRE sector.

As I understand the current versions, a flat or fair tax will fall primarily on wages and not on the income landlords earn in their sleep.

 

[georgephillip]

Yes, of course he does, by several orders of magnitude. However, the greedy envious are pissed because he refuses to give any of his stuff to them. They want the government to take it away from him and redistribute it.

Now tell us why Buffett and his ilk should not pay at least the same percentage of their income in taxes as their secretaries?

Hint: It has absolutely nothing to do with the percentage of total taxes that ARE being collected.

It has everything to do with taxes owed that are NOT being collected.

Are you admitting to being a bird brain?

 

[The T]

Only way to settle ALL of this discussion is a FLAT or FAIR Tax. Abolishing the IRS and the punative tax code that is used these days as a political weapon in the persuit of buying votes by politicians it was designed for. The Founders never meant for incomes to be taxed. If they had we would have started out that way.

Wealth Envy is not pretty...nor constructive.

The FLAT or FAIR tax could be viable if it also falls on Finance, Insurance and Real Estate, the so called FIRE sector.

As I understand the current versions, a flat or fair tax will fall primarily on wages and not on the income landlords earn in their sleep.

And who cares? This is where you get distracted by the wealth envy again. They still have to buy things to survive do they not?

You really need to get outta this mindset you're in. Seriously.

 

[daveman]

Buffet pays a lower rate, does he still pay more taxes than his secretary? Genius.

Yes, of course he does, by several orders of magnitude. However, the greedy envious are pissed because he refuses to give any of his stuff to them. They want the government to take it away from him and redistribute it.

Now tell us why Buffett and his ilk should not pay at least the same percentage of their income in taxes as their secretaries?

Hint: It has absolutely nothing to do with the percentage of total taxes that ARE being collected.

It has everything to do with taxes owed that are NOT being collected.

If you have evidence that people are illegally avoiding paying their taxes, you should report it.

If, however, you are merely butthurt because you think you're owed something you didn't earn, you should hush.