The true living God

[alang1216]

Maybe you didn’t understand what you were seeing or how it is all connected.

Maybe you didn’t understand what you were reading or made an honest attempt at understanding it.

I think we can both agree that one of us didn’t understand, I doubt we'll ever agree on which one.

The question has never been why doesn’t God reveal himself to us. The question has always been why haven’t we revealed ourselves to God.

That would be silly, he already knows us doesn't he? It would be like trying to tell God a joke. A waste of time, since he's already heard it.

 

[alang1216]

The complete lack of evidence for anything from before the BB.

What evidence were you expecting to find?

I have no idea but if I knew I'd already have a Nobel.

 

[alang1216]

Yet many claim they do know. Can you prove your claim?

It’s your claim to prove not mine.

Show me one of those supposed plans you say exists. I don’t believe you can.

I can to.

Can you thumbnail God’s plan for me. I didn’t get it from the link.

Jeremiah 29 “For I know the plans I have for you, declares the Lord, plans for welfare and not for evil, to give you a future and a hope.”

Why would God want us to suffer, some might ask? There are numerous verses in the Bible that talk about suffering. For example, Romans 5:3-5 says, "And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience; and patience, experience; and experience, hope: and hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us." We should rejoice in suffering, because it sharpens and strengthens us into a stronger Christian. Not only that, but 1 Peter 5:10 says, "But the God of all grace, who hath called us unto his eternal glory by Christ Jesus, after that ye have suffered a while, make you perfect, stablish, strengthen, settle you." Although we may suffer in life, God lives within us and He can offer us a perfect peace.

Suffering brings about change. Good comes from suffering. But don’t think that God orchestrates suffering. We do that. He just uses it to produce good.

That’s not really a plan. It’s more of an outline or a summary. If I had argued that was a plan you’d be arguing against it.

But for the sake of argument, what’s wrong with that plan?

I had a friend growing up who had MD. He got to watch 2 older brothers get weaker and die young. He got to watch a younger brother get weaker and weaker. He got to watch himself get weaker and weaker and he too died young. His parents, siblings, and friends got to watch the whole thing play out. Was that suffering worthwhile and to whom? Who was responsible and who could have prevented all that suffering? Please explain this plan and tell me who benefited.

 

[alang1216]

I don’t believe God wants us to suffer. He wants us to choose wisely.

I have allergies. Does God want me to choose my allergy medicine wisely?

 

[ding]

I don’t believe God wants us to suffer. He wants us to choose wisely.

I have allergies. Does God want me to choose my allergy medicine wisely?

Maybe.

Everything is choice.

 

[ding]

It’s your claim to prove not mine.

Show me one of those supposed plans you say exists. I don’t believe you can.

I can to.

Can you thumbnail God’s plan for me. I didn’t get it from the link.

Jeremiah 29 “For I know the plans I have for you, declares the Lord, plans for welfare and not for evil, to give you a future and a hope.”

Why would God want us to suffer, some might ask? There are numerous verses in the Bible that talk about suffering. For example, Romans 5:3-5 says, "And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience; and patience, experience; and experience, hope: and hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us." We should rejoice in suffering, because it sharpens and strengthens us into a stronger Christian. Not only that, but 1 Peter 5:10 says, "But the God of all grace, who hath called us unto his eternal glory by Christ Jesus, after that ye have suffered a while, make you perfect, stablish, strengthen, settle you." Although we may suffer in life, God lives within us and He can offer us a perfect peace.

Suffering brings about change. Good comes from suffering. But don’t think that God orchestrates suffering. We do that. He just uses it to produce good.

That’s not really a plan. It’s more of an outline or a summary. If I had argued that was a plan you’d be arguing against it.

But for the sake of argument, what’s wrong with that plan?

I had a friend growing up who had MD. He got to watch 2 older brothers get weaker and die young. He got to watch a younger brother get weaker and weaker. He got to watch himself get weaker and weaker and he too died young. His parents, siblings, and friends got to watch the whole thing play out. Was that suffering worthwhile and to whom? Who was responsible and who could have prevented all that suffering? Please explain this plan and tell me who benefited.

So that’s why you don’t believe in God. Because you can’t understand how anything good can come from this?

 

[ding]

The complete lack of evidence for anything from before the BB.

What evidence were you expecting to find?

I have no idea but if I knew I'd already have a Nobel.

According to you you do know. It’s the basis for your non-belief.

 

[alang1216]

I had a friend growing up who had MD. He got to watch 2 older brothers get weaker and die young. He got to watch a younger brother get weaker and weaker. He got to watch himself get weaker and weaker and he too died young. His parents, siblings, and friends got to watch the whole thing play out. Was that suffering worthwhile and to whom? Who was responsible and who could have prevented all that suffering? Please explain this plan and tell me who benefited.

So that’s why you don’t believe in God. Because you can’t understand how anything good can come from this?

It's one reason I've never changed my initial opinion. People, like you, have always told me that God is good and everything he does is for the good. Then I look around and see just the opposite. To paraphrase Chico Marx, who should I believe, you or my lying eyes?

 

[alang1216]

The complete lack of evidence for anything from before the BB.

What evidence were you expecting to find?

I have no idea but if I knew I'd already have a Nobel.

According to you you do know. It’s the basis for your non-belief.

According to me, I don't know. According to me, you don't know either. Actually it is the basis for my agnosticism.

 

[alang1216]

I don’t believe God wants us to suffer. He wants us to choose wisely.

I have allergies. Does God want me to choose my allergy medicine wisely?

Maybe.

Everything is choice.

Dodge.

 

[ding]

I had a friend growing up who had MD. He got to watch 2 older brothers get weaker and die young. He got to watch a younger brother get weaker and weaker. He got to watch himself get weaker and weaker and he too died young. His parents, siblings, and friends got to watch the whole thing play out. Was that suffering worthwhile and to whom? Who was responsible and who could have prevented all that suffering? Please explain this plan and tell me who benefited.

So that’s why you don’t believe in God. Because you can’t understand how anything good can come from this?

It's one reason I've never changed my initial opinion. People, like you, have always told me that God is good and everything he does is for the good. Then I look around and see just the opposite. To paraphrase Chico Marx, who should I believe, you or my lying eyes?

Existence is good. You have literally won the cosmic lottery and you are complaining it isn’t good enough for you.

 

[ding]

I don’t believe God wants us to suffer. He wants us to choose wisely.

I have allergies. Does God want me to choose my allergy medicine wisely?

Maybe.

Everything is choice.

Dodge.

No. It wasn’t. If that’s how silly you want to be about it then you shouldn’t complain when it is done right back at you.

 

[ding]

The complete lack of evidence for anything from before the BB.

What evidence were you expecting to find?

I have no idea but if I knew I'd already have a Nobel.

According to you you do know. It’s the basis for your non-belief.

According to me, I don't know. According to me, you don't know either. Actually it is the basis for my agnosticism.

If you didn’t know then you would not dismiss God as the creator of existence.

 

[alang1216]

I had a friend growing up who had MD. He got to watch 2 older brothers get weaker and die young. He got to watch a younger brother get weaker and weaker. He got to watch himself get weaker and weaker and he too died young. His parents, siblings, and friends got to watch the whole thing play out. Was that suffering worthwhile and to whom? Who was responsible and who could have prevented all that suffering? Please explain this plan and tell me who benefited.

So that’s why you don’t believe in God. Because you can’t understand how anything good can come from this?

It's one reason I've never changed my initial opinion. People, like you, have always told me that God is good and everything he does is for the good. Then I look around and see just the opposite. To paraphrase Chico Marx, who should I believe, you or my lying eyes?

Existence is good. You have literally won the cosmic lottery and you are complaining it isn’t good enough for you.

I'm doing great, the other 99% of the world's population, not so much. I'm not complaining about my lot, I'm sympathetic about all the others. I seem to care more about them than God does and he has the power to ease their suffering.

 

[alang1216]

The complete lack of evidence for anything from before the BB.

What evidence were you expecting to find?

I have no idea but if I knew I'd already have a Nobel.

According to you you do know. It’s the basis for your non-belief.

According to me, I don't know. According to me, you don't know either. Actually it is the basis for my agnosticism.

If you didn’t know then you would not dismiss God as the creator of existence.

More double negatives. You should get that looked at. Eschew obfuscation!

 

[ding]

I had a friend growing up who had MD. He got to watch 2 older brothers get weaker and die young. He got to watch a younger brother get weaker and weaker. He got to watch himself get weaker and weaker and he too died young. His parents, siblings, and friends got to watch the whole thing play out. Was that suffering worthwhile and to whom? Who was responsible and who could have prevented all that suffering? Please explain this plan and tell me who benefited.

So that’s why you don’t believe in God. Because you can’t understand how anything good can come from this?

It's one reason I've never changed my initial opinion. People, like you, have always told me that God is good and everything he does is for the good. Then I look around and see just the opposite. To paraphrase Chico Marx, who should I believe, you or my lying eyes?

Existence is good. You have literally won the cosmic lottery and you are complaining it isn’t good enough for you.

I'm doing great, the other 99% of the world's population, not so much. I'm not complaining about my lot, I'm sympathetic about all the others. I seem to care more about them than God does and he has the power to ease their suffering.

Why would it matter if it were your lot? It’s still complaining about the unfairness of life and blaming God for it. The reality is that you know God isn’t responsible because you don’t believe God exists. It’s just a convenient excuse to confirm your bias which is based upon a biased misunderstanding of scripture, faulty logic and poor observations.

I’m still scratching my head about what you previously wrote.

So you have never made the argument or implied that since life isn’t just or fair there can be no God?

Never made that argument. I understand the appeal of Christianity where the meek will inherit the earth. I don't believe it but if that is God's plan it's as good a plan as any.

 

[ABikerSailor]

You know, one time I was talking with a friend about life and how some got better chances than others, and we were wondering how a just God could allow some of these things to go on.

We also discussed how life wasn't always fair, and we came up with a really good thought to carry with us..........................

Life isn't fair, that is why we have to be.

 

[ding]

It actually seems to me that life is quite fair. As near as I can tell the argument that life isn’t fair is based upon errors and exceptions.

We live in a logical universe where every effect has a cause. As a rule we control our own destiny. As such our behaviors and actions play a large part in the fruit we bear. To argue that this is not the rule is illogical. So to argue that life is not fair can only come after a thorough investigation of both sides. You can’t say that something is bad or unfair without first knowing what is good or fair. So there must be goodness and fairness in the world that it is being compared to.

Furthermore, the true comparison should be made for existing versus not existing. Is there anything in the universe that you are aware of that you would rather be? No. You have already won the cosmic lottery. So how can someone who has won the cosmic lottery dare complain that life isn’t fair.

 

[ding]

You know, one time I was talking with a friend about life and how some got better chances than others, and we were wondering how a just God could allow some of these things to go on.

We also discussed how life wasn't always fair, and we came up with a really good thought to carry with us..........................

Life isn't fair, that is why we have to be.

In your conversation did you discuss the ways in which life was fair?

 

[ding]

What evidence were you expecting to find?

I have no idea but if I knew I'd already have a Nobel.

According to you you do know. It’s the basis for your non-belief.

According to me, I don't know. According to me, you don't know either. Actually it is the basis for my agnosticism.

If you didn’t know then you would not dismiss God as the creator of existence.

More double negatives. You should get that looked at. Eschew obfuscation!

Sometimes double negatives are needed when arguing against opponents who only deal in negatives.

If you want to eschew obfuscation then you shouldn’t plead ignorance on the origin of existence and then profess to know what didn’t create it