Ebola Containment In The Us > Your Thoughts & Ideas

[Silhouette]

Meanwhile, at the Legion of Doom.

About how serious ebola is. Is you don't wanna catch ebola don't touch anyone showing symptoms of it. Pretty simple. Quit being so damned stupid.

You also don't want rats coming into contact with the waste. They're not sure about if mosquitos can spread it, but they're pretty sure they can't. Just not 100% certain. And golly have you ever been to the south in the Summer? They're like black clouds that follow your head around.

Your "simplistic" easy-going attitude of ignorance could be deadly Delta.. Does that concern you at all? I'm not advocating panic. That's the worst thing anyone could do. But worse than panic in an epidemic is ignorance. Let's leave both out of the discussion.

When you don't know anything at all about infectious diseases and when we all know only partial facts about ebola, even the experts aren't 100% sure how it's spread, we don't lie to make everyone feel safe. We tell the truth. We say "we don't know". And from there you begin your research.

I'll say it again. We should be researching this epidemic offshore instead of importing it here into the general population.

 

[Kurmugeon]

This is from another forum, were a person poses the idea that advances in medical technology, since the advent of the Spanish Flu in 1918, make Ebola of little danger:

Medicine has improved dramatically since the early 1900s..

Epidemiology is the branch of medicine that deals with the transmission, and distribution of disease.. and we are particularly skilled and well equipped to deal with Ebola which has been around for years and is not caused by rats as the plague was.

Further, the best way to keep the US safe is to help eradicate the disease in West Africa.

Panic and fear mongering will not contribute to the solutions.

In 1st world countries, transportation, and the common occurrence of inter-city commuting for work has greatly increased as well.

The advances in medical technology do not apply to most of the people who get Ebola, since the new experimental drugs are simply not available in anything beyond quantities to treat a handful of people.

The increases in mobility of 1st world country societies, to spread the disease faster than burnout, more than offsets the advantages of medicine.

From the CDC website:
Treatment | Ebola Hemorrhagic Fever | CDC

Treatment

No FDA-approved vaccine or medicine (e.g., antiviral drug) is available for Ebola.

Symptoms of Ebola are treated as they appear. The following basic interventions, when used early, can significantly improve the chances of survival:

Providing intravenous fluids (IV)and balancing electrolytes (body salts)
Maintaining oxygen status and blood pressure
Treating other infections if they occur

Experimental vaccines and treatments for Ebola are under development, but they have not yet been fully tested for safety or effectiveness.

Recovery from Ebola depends on good supportive care and the patient’s immune response. People who recover from Ebola infection develop antibodies that last for at least 10 years, possibly longer. It isn't known if people who recover are immune for life or if they can become infected with a different species of Ebola. Some people who have recovered from Ebola have developed long-term complications, such as joint and vision problems.

So, as long as the hospitals are not so completely overrun, that you cannot get care, they will put you on an IV, put an oxygen tube in your nose, watch your pulse monitor with a crash cart nearby, and give you anti-biotics, bathing and dressing of secondary bed sores.

Advantages to be sure, but not a night and day difference from what is done in Africa right now.

It is not fear mongering or panic to question why we haven't taken the reasonable steps of restricting travel into hot zones, and placing people returning from hot zones into a few weeks of isolation.

-

 

[Kurmugeon]

Meanwhile, at the Legion of Doom.

About how serious ebola is. Is you don't wanna catch ebola don't touch anyone showing symptoms of it. Pretty simple. Quit being so damned stupid.

Here is information from the CDC on Ebola and how it gets transmitted:




From the CDC Website:


Ebola Hemorrhagic Fever | CDC

What are body fluids?
Ebola has been detected in blood and many body fluids. Body fluids include saliva, mucus, vomit, feces, sweat, tears, breast milk, urine, and semen.

Can Ebola spread by coughing? By sneezing?
Unlike respiratory illnesses like measles or chickenpox, which can be transmitted by virus particles that remain suspended in the air after an infected person coughs or sneezes, Ebola is transmitted by direct contact with body fluids of a person who has symptoms of Ebola disease. Although coughing and sneezing are not common symptoms of Ebola, if a symptomatic patient with Ebola coughs or sneezes on someone, and saliva or mucus come into contact with that person’s eyes, nose or mouth, these fluids may transmit the disease.

What does “direct contact” mean?
Direct contact means that body fluids (blood, saliva, mucus, vomit, urine, or feces) from an infected person (alive or dead) have touched someone’s eyes, nose, or mouth or an open cut, wound, or abrasion.

How long does Ebola live outside the body?
Ebola is killed with hospital-grade disinfectants (such as household bleach). Ebola on dried on surfaces such as doorknobs and countertops can survive for several hours; however, virus in body fluids (such as blood) can survive up to several days at room temperature.

Are patients who recover from Ebola immune for life? Can they get it again - the same or a different strain?
Recovery from Ebola depends on good supportive clinical care and a patient’s immune response. Available evidence shows that people who recover from Ebola infection develop antibodies that last for at least 10 years, possibly longer.

We don’t know if people who recover are immune for life or if they can become infected with a different species of Ebola.

If someone survives Ebola, can he or she still spread the virus?
Once someone recovers from Ebola, they can no longer spread the virus. However, Ebola virus has been found in semen for up to 3 months. People who recover from Ebola are advised to abstain from sex or use condoms for 3 months.

Can Ebola be spread through mosquitos?
There is no evidence that mosquitos or other insects can transmit Ebola virus. Only mammals (for example, humans, bats, monkeys and apes) have shown the ability to spread and become infected with Ebola virus.


Q&As on Transmission | Ebola Hemorrhagic Fever | CDC Link: Q&As on Transmission | Ebola Hemorrhagic Fever | CDC

 

[Rotagilla]

Sometimes liberty is dangerous.

Ebola is death. So are a hundred million other things, all around us. Half a million people die of the flu every year. Car accidents kill another million and a quarter.

I'm a lot more likely to be killed by a driver with the flu than I am to get ebola - should we set up "flu" checkpoints on the highway?

This post displays the abysmal ignorance that is going to be our collective demise. Here's how...let me give you an analogy.

Let's say people are chickens. And what you just said is "more chickens die from crossing the road than disease". That's because farmers are hypervigilant about the spread of disease because their livelihoods depend on it. But if chickens weren't isolated in coops on individual farms and were just running around all over the place with their liberties and civil rights all in place, a disease like coccidiosis would spread like wildfire. You could have half the chicken population of the world knocked out in a jiffy.

Infectious disease doesn't behave like static statistics for other types of deaths like you just mentioned. Those remain relatively level on the graph year after year. Infectious disease makes the line on the graph go vertical instead of horizontal....

The trouble begins when the disease begins to not just overwhelm individual immune response, but when the dead and dying begin to overwhelm infrastructure. That's when you get a dark age in a civilization. WHAM! Gone.

So don't talk about car accidents like people can catch them from each other. When you speak with authority like that on something you know nothing about, you cause people to die from misinformation.

You're wasting your time. His entire repertoire is exaggeration, snark, and evasion...usually in that order.

 

[Silhouette]

The CDC, as with the sudden increase in HIV in impressionable youth ages 13-24 in the last decade, has its head up its ass on ebola too. Here's what your quotes from their website say Delta. Let's pick them apart for the sake of saving lives, shall we?

What does “direct contact” mean?Direct contact means that body fluids (blood, saliva, mucus, vomit, urine, or feces) from an infected person (alive or dead) have touched someone’s eyes, nose, or mouth or an open cut, wound, or abrasion.

They left some stuff out there. You can also get it touching someone's vomit, urine, feces, tears, breastmilk, semen, dead body, dead body fluids up to hours after they've died, bandaging, clothing etc. if those came in contact with them. They also believe it can be passed in sweat, so just touching their arm or perspiring feverish forehead, etc could expose you... And of course they left out the zoonotic components like bat feces, probably rat feces and...well to be honest they have no idea whatsoever how many animal species can carry ebola. They've just "narrowed it down" to between bats and antelope. Such a divergence in species type though suggests it might be highly zoonotic. Then there is all the animals' bodily fluids, feces...etc. etc. you shouldn't touch.

If someone survives Ebola, can he or she still spread the virus?Once someone recovers from Ebola, they can no longer spread the virus. However, Ebola virus has been found in semen for up to 3 months. People who recover from Ebola are advised to abstain from sex or use condoms for 3 months.

The quote above is my personal favorite. It says "once someone recovers from Ebola, they can no longer spread the virus." It then goes on to say without skipping a beat that "Ebola virus has been found in semen for up to 3 months". So you are advised [but not mandated of course, individual freedoms, especially sexual ones dontcha know] to wear a condom for 3 months. I've heard it's 6 months to be dead certain but of course the CDC backed away from that "sexually controversial hard line"...

The CDC is negligent. In full disclosure it should say "we really don't know all there is to know about ebola, so the highest precautions are called for until we do. If you know of anyone who has travelled to West Africa, you should simply avoid coming within 100 yards of them or anything they've touched. Either that or we ban travellers who have spent time in West Africa.

 

[Vigilante]

US must stop all flights from Ebola-stricken WAfrica to prevent more outbreaks in US

UKMailOnline ^

Epidemiologist says US must stop all flights from Ebola-stricken West Africa to prevent more outbreaks in America David Dausey, a Yale-educated disease researcher, has argued that the bungled handling of the Thomas Eric Duncan case proves the US must close its borders to keep Ebola out of the country He is one of the first experts to advocate the closing of borders The CDC maintains that blocking flights from West Africa would make the Ebola outbreak there worse by hurting the local economy ....

 

[Rotagilla]

US must stop all flights from Ebola-stricken WAfrica to prevent more outbreaks in US

UKMailOnline ^

Epidemiologist says US must stop all flights from Ebola-stricken West Africa to prevent more outbreaks in America David Dausey, a Yale-educated disease researcher, has argued that the bungled handling of the Thomas Eric Duncan case proves the US must close its borders to keep Ebola out of the country He is one of the first experts to advocate the closing of borders The CDC maintains that blocking flights from West Africa would make the Ebola outbreak there worse by hurting the local economy ....

The CDC is ridiculous...a country's economy has nothing to do with whether or not ebola should be contained.

 

[Silhouette]

US must stop all flights from Ebola-stricken WAfrica to prevent more outbreaks in US

UKMailOnline ^

Epidemiologist says US must stop all flights from Ebola-stricken West Africa to prevent more outbreaks in America David Dausey, a Yale-educated disease researcher, has argued that the bungled handling of the Thomas Eric Duncan case proves the US must close its borders to keep Ebola out of the country He is one of the first experts to advocate the closing of borders The CDC maintains that blocking flights from West Africa would make the Ebola outbreak there worse by hurting the local economy ....

It's either stop the flights coming from West Africa or the world [WHO] stops our flights from landing anywhere else. That's what it's going to come down to.

 

[patmac]

1. Cut all flights out of Africa....
2. Do what Liberia is doing. Anyone that comes in contact = contain them for 21 days. By force if needed.

...and just where did the Dallas patient come from?

he sauntered in via Brussels........

 

[Vigilante]

1. Cut all flights out of Africa....
2. Do what Liberia is doing. Anyone that comes in contact = contain them for 21 days. By force if needed.

...and just where did the Dallas patient come from?

he sauntered in via Brussels........

He had to have a passport stating where he had been and when, all you have to do is have the Airport monkeys, check them instead of feeling up 80 year old wheel chair bound grandmothers, and 4 year old little girls!

 

[Silhouette]

I wonder if the guy who thought this post was such a good laugh is laughing now? Ebola just bitch-slapped "the worlds best healthcare system"...

 

[patmac]

second Ebola case in Texas right now, as reported on CNN...person stated they had contact with Duncan ( a.k.a "US Patient Zero" ).....

 

[Derideo_Te]

second Ebola case in Texas right now, as reported on CNN...person stated they had contact with Duncan ( a.k.a "US Patient Zero" ).....

 

[Silhouette]

Well that guy tested negative. I notice airline workers are starting to wise up.

(Reuters) - About 200 airline cabin cleaners walked off the job at New York's LaGuardia Airport on Thursday to protest what they say is insufficient protection from exposure to Ebola for workers whose jobs include cleaning up vomit and bathrooms....

..
"The bottom line is, I don't want to die," said Shareeka Elliott, 27, a terminal cleaner at JFK who said she attended the training out of a fear of contracting Ebola at work.
Cabin cleaner Marisa Collado, 46, said in Spanish: "When we clean toilets we don't know if they are infected with Ebola."
.Airline cleanup crews walk off job in New York over Ebola concerns Reuters

It's a little eerie that the support staff dealing with ebola on the front lines are the ones dying of it. Britain and France wasted no time doing the right thing. If the US wants the world to continue regarding it as an ebola hot spot then I guess we'd better get used to the idea that our flights will be blocked too.

So then you just do the math. What's more expensive? Importing ebola via asymptomatic dudes like Mr. Duncan from these West African hot spots, or the losses from outgoing flights not reaching their destination as we become an ebola hot spot?

Oh, they're screening people for fevers...which doesn't solve a thing. And they're doing this stateside too, not at the departure points. I guess the Dallas guy who came out clean [luckily] wasn't even on the watch list. He was one, if positive for ebola, who would've slipped through one of the many cracks in our "system" of "containing it"..

 

[skye]

open borders? taking the fever at airports? it's no good.

Hussein Obola will change America as we know it.

hello ebola...thank you Obola.

 

[Derideo_Te]

The current math on Ebola indicates that it is still spreading at a rate greater than it can be treated.

But given that treatment for Ebola where it started was already abysmal that is hardly surprising.

The math that we need to look for next is what happens when it reaches places where there are good treatment facilities.

Yes, there will still be fatalities because survival appears to depend on how healthy the infected person's immune system is to begin with and their ability to fight off the disease. The odds are that Ebola will not kill as many people in western nations with better healthcare facilities.

The missing factors are treatments and vaccines. On that front I have no doubt whatsoever that the medical community around the world is working flat out on both of those issues. They will probably have something available within the next 3 to 6 months in my opinion.

This is going to be the first major world wide epidemic since the Spanish Flu after WW1. At this point it is still too early to tell if the death toll will reach anything like the same numbers.

But there are various factors that are positive. Ebola must be spread via contact with body fluids which means that it is possible to take simple precautions to keep oneself safe. Washing your hands and not touching your mouth and eyes will be one option. Not shaking hands with people will be another.

So yes, we are at the beginning of an epidemic that probably has at least one infected person without symptoms in at least 50 nations in the world today and it will be in every nation by Thanksgiving. That is the nature of Ebola and shutting down air travel would not have stopped this from happening. During the height of the epidemic I expect air travel to be grounded but by that time it will be counterproductive since that is how the vaccines and treatments will need to be shipped to where they are needed.

So let's stop being alarmists and pointing fingers. An epidemic is a natural occurrence and if it wasn't Ebola it would have been something else and if it wasn't now it would be at some other point in time. Just like volcanoes and earthquakes we know that they will happen but we cannot predict exactly when they will occur and how severe they will be.

Time to be practical and deal with this new reality.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

open borders? taking the fever at airports? it's no good.

Hussein Obola will change America as we know it.

hello ebola...thank you Obola.

Have Ebola? Hope a bus -- Obama's medical advise

Sent from smartphone using my wits and Taptalk

 

[CrusaderFrank]

The current math on Ebola indicates that it is still spreading at a rate greater than it can be treated.

But given that treatment for Ebola where it started was already abysmal that is hardly surprising.

The math that we need to look for next is what happens when it reaches places where there are good treatment facilities.

Yes, there will still be fatalities because survival appears to depend on how healthy the infected person's immune system is to begin with and their ability to fight off the disease. The odds are that Ebola will not kill as many people in western nations with better healthcare facilities.

The missing factors are treatments and vaccines. On that front I have no doubt whatsoever that the medical community around the world is working flat out on both of those issues. They will probably have something available within the next 3 to 6 months in my opinion.

This is going to be the first major world wide epidemic since the Spanish Flu after WW1. At this point it is still too early to tell if the death toll will reach anything like the same numbers.

But there are various factors that are positive. Ebola must be spread via contact with body fluids which means that it is possible to take simple precautions to keep oneself safe. Washing your hands and not touching your mouth and eyes will be one option. Not shaking hands with people will be another.

So yes, we are at the beginning of an epidemic that probably has at least one infected person without symptoms in at least 50 nations in the world today and it will be in every nation by Thanksgiving. That is the nature of Ebola and shutting down air travel would not have stopped this from happening. During the height of the epidemic I expect air travel to be grounded but by that time it will be counterproductive since that is how the vaccines and treatments will need to be shipped to where they are needed.

So let's stop being alarmists and pointing fingers. An epidemic is a natural occurrence and if it wasn't Ebola it would have been something else and if it wasn't now it would be at some other point in time. Just like volcanoes and earthquakes we know that they will happen but we cannot predict exactly when they will occur and how severe they will be.

Time to be practical and deal with this new reality.

The only positive aspect is that Duncan wasn't contagious while on the plane.

We might not have another case for a few weeks here in the USA

Overall I'm not optimistic

Sent from smartphone using my wits and Taptalk

 

[Silhouette]

So yes, we are at the beginning of an epidemic that probably has at least one infected person without symptoms in at least 50 nations in the world today and it will be in every nation by Thanksgiving. That is the nature of Ebola and shutting down air travel would not have stopped this from happening. During the height of the epidemic I expect air travel to be grounded but by that time it will be counterproductive since that is how the vaccines and treatments will need to be shipped to where they are needed.

So let's stop being alarmists and pointing fingers. An epidemic is a natural occurrence and if it wasn't Ebola it would have been something else and if it wasn't now it would be at some other point in time. Just like volcanoes and earthquakes we know that they will happen but we cannot predict exactly when they will occur and how severe they will be.

Time to be practical and deal with this new reality.

I'd say your predictions about how far it will spread once the US starts acting like an active reservoir, unchecked-springboard to broadcast the virus throughout the world are accurate, roughly, give or take 6 months. That's assuming other countries will agree to commit fiscal and health suicide in order to placate the US's ignorance and hubris.

That's not a guarantee BTW.

Or, the US could simply ban all travellers coming from the afflicted West African countries without a mandatory stayover in 21 day quarantine. Not all things or natural occurances behave like ebola or another like-virus. Epidemics can bring a country to its knees so quickly that it will make your head spin. As such, it is an issue of the maximum national security alarm. Do you post from Russia I wonder?

 

[Asclepias]

The NEW WORLD ORDER is upon us. Run for your lives.