Zone1 My departure from Catholicism (very long OP)

[Meriweather]

As you are doing now, right?

I am confused. What am I doing right now?

 

[Foxfyre]

I share your view. There are many Godly people in the worldly, Catholic, system. They too are a part of Jesus's church. However, not all Catholics are Godly people just like not all Baptists, etc., are Godly people.

Very true. Jesus commands us to love and do good to one another. Being a member of a Church denomination or congregation can help us do that but alas there are some that do not encourage that. And some people just never get it.

 

[K9Buck]

I am confused. What am I doing right now?

You are trying to muddy the waters in order to deceive others into following the worldly institution called the Catholic Church instead of following God the Father.

 

[Foxfyre]

You, my brother, are blessed with the gift of discernment. Countless times I have shared with others, as you just did, that one doesn't need to have an encyclopedic knowledge of the Bible to be a faithful follower of Jesus. The "Great Commandment" issued by Jesus is probably all that one needs to believe and do.

I once met a young, teenage, girl that had significant learning disabilities that I believed was more filled with the Holy Spirit than anyone I had ever met and it's doubtful that she could recite the Ten Commandments.

Well make that a 'sister' as I am woman, hear me roar. But thank you.

 

[Foxfyre]

Jesus is the head of the "one true church" and it definitely exists. It's just extraordinarily unlikely that any living human being knows all that it entails.

To avoid division when I am among other Christians, I stick to the Great Commandment. However, sometimes heretics spread egregiously false teachings that must be confronted.

I too try to address false teaching that can harm people but I try, and I suspect you also do as well, to do it gently. I don't know a soul who came to know and love Jesus by being told he/she was going to hell and/or that he/she was not a real Christian because he/she belonged to this or that church or no church.

I grieve for all those who reject the Christ because of the ugly or unattractive way He was introduced to them.

 

[Foxfyre]

I recently typed it all up to share with some family members, friends, and acquaintances. I merely pasted it here.

I don't share it with all of my Catholic family and friends because some of them have a cult-like devotion to the CC. They love God and one another and try to live Godly lives. I think that's all that matters and so I leave them be. I certainly don't believe that it's a salvational issue.

I agree. If somebody believes he/she belongs to the 'one true Church' and everybody else doesn't so be it. If he/she knows and loves God he/she is blessed. I suspect God gives us a lot of leeway in our theology so long as we don't use it to harm people.

As I posted elsewhere in this thread I'm pretty sure when we get to Heaven we're all going to have a good laugh at how much of all of this we got wrong.

 

[Foxfyre]

Exactly right. Although there is a tongue-in-cheek saying that, if you want to learn false doctrines, go to church. Lol.

But I agree that finding fellowship and Godly spouses is best done through a Godly church!

And as the scripture says, 'neglect not the gathering of the saints' and we are to meet together and cheer each other up and bear one another's burdens, worship and pray together. I know from my own experience that living the Christian life is much easier and more consistent when we do that. And yes, I have never researched it, but I do believe marriages that begin in the church are more likely to be loving and lasting than those that do not.

 

[K9Buck]

I agree. If somebody believes he/she belongs to the 'one true Church' and everybody else doesn't so be it. If he/she knows and loves God he/she is blessed. I suspect God gives us a lot of leeway in our theology so long as we don't use it to harm people.

As I posted elsewhere in this thread I'm pretty sure when we get to Heaven we're all going to have a good laugh at how much of all of this we got wrong.

I'm always asking myself what I don't know and what I am misunderstanding. I stick to the scriptures and oftentimes just have to acknowledge that I don't know.

 

[K9Buck]

And as the scripture says, 'neglect not the gathering of the saints' and we are to meet together and cheer each other up and bear one another's burdens, worship and pray together. I know from my own experience that living the Christian life is much easier and more consistent when we do that. And yes, I have never researched it, but I do believe marriages that begin in the church are more likely to be loving and lasting than those that do not.

Totally agree.

I laugh when I hear people complaining about "Christian nationalism". One day everyone will be a Christian "nationalist".

 

[K9Buck]

Well make that a 'sister' as I am woman, hear me roar. But thank you.

Ah ok my sister in Christ!

 

[Meriweather]

You are trying to muddy the waters in order to deceive others into following the worldly institution called the Catholic Church instead of following God the Father.

What I am doing is presenting the wider picture, more of the whole.

Consider this: Are your posts about judging and condemning the Catholic Church without so much as hearing a defense?

My faith is based on the Bible--the whole of it. The Catholic Church--despite its faults--has been great at presenting the entire Bible every three years. All homilies speak to the scriptures being read. This is what the Church offers.

The fact that non-Catholics are convinced they should not be Catholic because this Pope said that, and that other Pope did this, and a small percentage of priests were pedophiles does not negate the fact that every three years, the Catholic faith reads through the entire Bible. (Make that once a year for those attending daily Mass.)

 

[K9Buck]

I too try to address false teaching that can harm people but I try, and I suspect you also do as well, to do it gently. I don't know a soul who came to know and love Jesus by being told he/she was going to hell and/or that he/she was not a real Christian because he/she belonged to this or that church or no church.

I grieve for all those who reject the Christ because of the ugly or unattractive way He was introduced to them.

I start gentle and remain gentle until the smug heretics enter the discussion and begin spewing anti-Biblical heresies.

 

[Foxfyre]

I have never found a sincere ex-Catholic, and I still haven't. Do you ever hear such self-justifying hate and nonsense from an ex-Methodist for example,NO , Hillary has been attacking her own church for ages. They are wrong about abortion, They are wrong about homosexualty, we should have Lesbian bishops....She seems to believe nothing. You can get away with that in most non-Catholic churches but not in Catholicism
Pete Buttigied is in direct confrontation with the Catholic Catechsim and all of Catholic history with his gay 'union'
Same with Biden and abortion.

Pope Benedict once said of Judas, If he had left the Church in accord with his lack of faith and his behavior he would never have betreayed Jesus. Pete and Joe betray their Church every day.

I know many ex-Catholic and ex-Protestants that are very godly people based on their words, demeanor, behavior, the love the emanates from them. I know those who rejected the Catholicism and/or Protestantism of their youth who do not seem to be godly at all.

I am very careful not to presume I am given any authority to judge their hearts. The same goes for those who identify with the Catholic Church and Protestant Church, even some who seem to be quite active in their various congregations. There are good and bad. Sheep and goats graze in the same pasture.

I also know some Jewish people and others who are godly people based on their words, demeanor, behavior, their ability to love and care about others.

In my opinion, it is not the religious group we identify with that makes us godly but our relationship with the living God.

 

[Arlette]

I departed from Catholicism in the second grade, after an altercation with a nun. Nuns are sad people. Most priests are alcoholics.

 

[K9Buck]

Are your posts about judging and condemning the Catholic Church without so much as hearing a defense?

We must discern between what is and is not from God. Nowhere have I "condemned" another. Refuting unbiblical, Catholic, dogma is not condemnation.

God wants us to relate to him, to follow him, to praise him, to exalt him, to seek his forgiveness and his blessing. The Catholic Church takes God out of the equation. They teach to pray to Mary or to a saint instead of to God. They teach to exalt priests rather than God. They teach to seek forgiveness through a priest rather than from God.

There is no scripture to support the doctrines of praying to Mary or to any other dead human, save perhaps Jesus. Although even Jesus deferred us to pray to the Father.

I encourage you to read my lengthy post about why I left Catholicism and then perhaps we can try this again.

 

[K9Buck]

I know many ex-Catholic that are very godly people based on their words, demeanor, behavior, the love the emanates from them. I know those who rejected the Catholicism and/or Protestantism of their youth who do not seem to be godly at all.

I am very careful not to presume I am given any authority to judge their hearts. The same goes for those who identify with the Catholic Church and Protestant Church, even some who seem to be quite active in their various congregations. There are good and bad. Sheep and goats graze in the same pasture.

I also know some Jewish people and others who are godly people based on their words, demeanor, behavior, their ability to love and care about others.

In my opinion, it is not the religious group we identify with that makes us godly but our relationship with the living God.

It's my OPINION based on my understanding of Jesus's nature that many atheists, Buddhists, Muslims, etc., will go STRAIGHT to Heaven when they die. Again, this is only MY OPINION and perhaps a topic for another thread.

 

[Arlette]

I departed from Catholicism in the second grade, after an altercation with a nun. Nuns are sad people. Most priests are alcoholics.

I remember the little boys in my class all worried about their fist diddling by a priest. One of the older boys, an altar boy, never walked right again after a priest diddled him. He walked like John Wayne

 

[Meriweather]

I encourage you to read my lengthy post about why I left Catholicism and then perhaps we can try this again.

I did read it. I saw the cut and pastes of non-Catholic criticisms. Left out were the explanations with roots and foundation in Apostolic times. That is all I have been trying to do...invite you into a discussion of early Church practices, how they came about, the roots stemming from Judaism, the faith Christ was born into. Its about God in our midst, as it has been since Genesis. It is about God in our midst, even as we stumble, even if we fail. God never fails us. He finds us where we are.

 

[K9Buck]

I did read it. I saw the cut and pastes of non-Catholic criticisms. Left out were the explanations with roots and foundation in Apostolic times.

Then respond to my argument and the scriptures that I shared with your own arguments and supporting scriptures.

 

[Foxfyre]

So let's have a little reality check. The Catholic Church has been in existence (as we conceive it) for about two thousand years. The Church has CONSTANTLY sought to remain faithful to the teachings of Christ and the guidance of the "founding fathers" [to coin a phrase]. It recognizes not only the Scriptures themselves, but also traditions that originated with the Apostles and have carried forward. It employs an army of linguists, theologians, and scientists around the world who strive to ensure that "we" are understanding everything correctly, even to correcting translations of biblical texts as new information comes to light.

The Church has done a lot of awful things in its history, but one is only appalled at these acts in a vacuum, as HUMANS have done a lot of awful things, in the name of religious dogma and other inexplicable principles. The Church is a human organization, like it or not. But it has always strived to "get it right," and it continues to do so today.

For illustration, there is TREMENDOUS global pressure on the Vatical (the Church) to accept homosexuals and other sexual irregulars, to condone abortion in some circumstances, to embrace divorce and remarriage as endemic to the human condition, but it declines to do these things, because the Scriptures and Traditions are clear, in the opposite direction of the public pressure.

K9Buck, you have embraced the folly of Protestantism. You believe that you can read the Book and decide for yourself what it means. In effect, you say, "No, I'm smarter than your armies of theologians and hundreds of years of study."

Based on what? Conceit?

Your thinking is literally analogous to someone with a telescope, spending 30 years looking up into the sky and coming to the conclusion that all of what astronomers have figured out for the past thousands of years is wrong, because that is not what your scope sightings tell you.

You are a fool. You have a right to be a fool, but make no mistake about it. There is only one true Christian Church, and you have rejected it out of nothing but personal arrogance.

P.S. I admit that I did not go through the OP in detail. I have better things to do with my time, and you don't have to test every apple in the barrel to conclude that it is a barrel of rotten apples.

Do Catholics not teach the Sermon on the Mount?

Matthew 5:
22 But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, ‘Raca ,’ is answerable to the court. And anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell."

"Raca" is translated empty-headed, stupid, idiot or whatever.

Now as I understand all of the Bible, it isn't the words themselves that are the problem but the intent of the one speaking them. Be careful of trying to destroy the faith of another Christian as that never comes from God.