What Is "Fair Share of Taxes"?

[kaz]

Assuming you're "nonrich", what exactly ruined you? And how is it anyone's fault?

Class warfare

Class warfare the greedy rich a-hole GOP has been winning for 30 years, dupe.

Can you explain the process? How are the greedy rich a-hole GOP taking the property of the "nonrich"?

Do they swoop in and steal their money? Of course not
They are too smart for that. The worker creates the wealth. The wealthy decide how it gets distributed

The rich don't "distribute" anything except their own money. Corporations pay workers to perform a task. That's all they're entitled to. Corporations combine labor, land and capital to create a product that hopefully has value in the market. The claim that workers are solely responsible for producing the product is obviously false.

You don't get anywhere arguing with communists. And in this case, rightwinger, who wants to french kiss my daughter. Or at least he says so. You get what you deserve wasting your time on him

 

[Centinel]

Class warfare

Class warfare the greedy rich a-hole GOP has been winning for 30 years, dupe.

Can you explain the process? How are the greedy rich a-hole GOP taking the property of the "nonrich"?

Do they swoop in and steal their money? Of course not
They are too smart for that. The worker creates the wealth. The wealthy decide how it gets distributed

So none of the worker's property is actually taken from him. So what's the problem?

When you sell something, you still own it, right?

No you don't. If you sell something, you no longer own it.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Why can't a person stash his property wherever he wishes? What business is it of yours?

We're not talking about "property." He can moor his yacht wherever he's willing to pay the moorage fees. See the difference there?

A person's money is his property

Move to Somalia- you people can't see past the end of your noses. Too bad you didn't educate yourself and work hard enough lol....

Ah that old chestnut

Yes I think my money is my property I must want anarchy

Tell me if someone stole your money would you call the cops or would you just say oh well that money wasn't really my property?

Taxes are the price of citizenry. The problem is Reaganist pander to the rich and giant corps, dupe. And wrecking the nonrich and the country DUH.

If what you say is true then shouldn't everyone pay income taxes?

And why should some dollars get taxed at 39% and others at 0%

 

[Skull Pilot]

Nearly 50% of Americans pay no federal income tax, but they pay sales taxes, excise taxes, property taxes, SS and Medicare taxes, and so on. Quit lying by saying that 50% don't pay any taxes, because it's a straight out lie.

buy a stick of gum, and you're a taxpayer, bam!

LOL

BTW, I thought SS and Medicare were people investing in their own future. It was just a lie, huh, the're just taxes ...

Lower income earners pay the highest percentage of state taxes in almost every state. The less you make, the greater percentage of your income you pay in state taxes. The wealthy pay the least at the state level as a percentage of income. It's amazing how cons never discuss this absurd fact.

That's a state by state issue and it makes no sense to talk about it here which is why I tens to only talk about federal taxes as that is consistent across the country

But tell me this why not treat a dollar like everything else we tax?

Federal taxes are also much higher, particularly for higher income people. Federal taxes also include taxes for many State services which should be removed and put into State taxes so States could decide how they want their money spent

If you count ALL taxes and fees, EVERYONE pays 20-30% of income, dupe.

So what? That still doesn't explain why so many people pay no federal income tax

 

[Skull Pilot]

You think that salaries are set by the income tax rates of employees and that the employer pays the income taxes of his employees and you're telling me to take an econ class?

That's hilarious

As a market, yes. Take a couple of econ classes, they'll explain it to you that employees expect you to pay their taxes just like you expect your customers to pay your taxes. And good luck replacing the employees who shit can you because you don't think their taxes are your problem.

What's hilarious is that you don't think when you pay employees, the taxes they pay are ultimately paid by your customers. You don't need any stinking customers for your employees to pay taxes! LOL, yeah ...

Have you ever even had an employee?

Not one employee has ever said I want you to pay my income taxes when we were discussing salary.

Income taxes are paid by the employee NOT the employer I don't know how many times I have to tell you this before it sinks in

And it's the gross salary and all it's related expenses that is passed on to customers not the income tax employees pay every week

SInce you don't know this because you obviously have never had to meet a payroll let me break it down for you

If I pay a person 50K a year that's 1923 a pay period

The employee has these amounts withheld

Federal tax 296
Social Security 119
Medicare 28

Then any state taxes

This is ALL paid from the employee's salary the employer does NOT pay these for his employees

The costs the employer bears is the matching social security and medicare contributions and state and federal unemployment taxes

As far as setting costs for services I only use the employee's gross pay and the FICA , SUTA and FUTA taxes as part of the calculation

So you see I do not use and no one uses the tax withholding of employees in cost of goods or services calculations

I'm going beyond your simplistic view of the world of who writes the check to the government. Wait a minute, you write the check ...

I write the check for MY taxes just like you do
Your employer does not write that check for you

really, you don't do your employee's tax withholdings? Don't call me when you're in jail, I'll just laugh at you

You're a fucking idiot

Why don't you hire some people and learn what payroll is all about

 

[Skull Pilot]

Really since 12/7/41 how many attacks have they stopped? And don't forget the military didn't stop that one either

I'll answer when you tell me how many people has the lock on your door stopped from walking into your house?

I mean just the blood thirsty Canadians alone, they're just looking for a moment of weakness to pounce on us.

We don't need a military, wow. You're really not connected to the world. You need to read the news more often. Or ever.

I'll say it again you are the one that brought up military spending not me

I never once said we didn't need a military I said it does not protect our personal property. You are using the most abstract example possible to make your point

And I have given you examples of us actually being attacked but you say the attacks that never happened are more important.

You gave the examples of 9/11, where we kicked their asses, and Pearl Harbor, where we kicked their asses

But we didn't stop the attacks on our country. That's what you said the military does

You're an eight year old

What's the matter can't handle the truth

 

[Wilbur Right]

So what? That still doesn't explain why so many people pay no federal income tax

Dude that EITC has been explained to you so many times I am starting to believe you are willfully stupid.

What good does that do you? Being willfully stupid that is.

 

[kaz]

Class warfare the greedy rich a-hole GOP has been winning for 30 years, dupe.

Can you explain the process? How are the greedy rich a-hole GOP taking the property of the "nonrich"?

Do they swoop in and steal their money? Of course not
They are too smart for that. The worker creates the wealth. The wealthy decide how it gets distributed

So none of the worker's property is actually taken from him. So what's the problem?

When you sell something, you still own it, right?

No you don't. If you sell something, you no longer own it.

You know I'm making fun of the left, right? Read the quotes in this post. When you hire a worker and pay them to produce something for you, they still own it, you're stealing from them!

 

[kaz]

As a market, yes. Take a couple of econ classes, they'll explain it to you that employees expect you to pay their taxes just like you expect your customers to pay your taxes. And good luck replacing the employees who shit can you because you don't think their taxes are your problem.

What's hilarious is that you don't think when you pay employees, the taxes they pay are ultimately paid by your customers. You don't need any stinking customers for your employees to pay taxes! LOL, yeah ...

Have you ever even had an employee?

Not one employee has ever said I want you to pay my income taxes when we were discussing salary.

Income taxes are paid by the employee NOT the employer I don't know how many times I have to tell you this before it sinks in

And it's the gross salary and all it's related expenses that is passed on to customers not the income tax employees pay every week

SInce you don't know this because you obviously have never had to meet a payroll let me break it down for you

If I pay a person 50K a year that's 1923 a pay period

The employee has these amounts withheld

Federal tax 296
Social Security 119
Medicare 28

Then any state taxes

This is ALL paid from the employee's salary the employer does NOT pay these for his employees

The costs the employer bears is the matching social security and medicare contributions and state and federal unemployment taxes

As far as setting costs for services I only use the employee's gross pay and the FICA , SUTA and FUTA taxes as part of the calculation

So you see I do not use and no one uses the tax withholding of employees in cost of goods or services calculations

I'm going beyond your simplistic view of the world of who writes the check to the government. Wait a minute, you write the check ...

I write the check for MY taxes just like you do
Your employer does not write that check for you

really, you don't do your employee's tax withholdings? Don't call me when you're in jail, I'll just laugh at you

You're a fucking idiot

Why don't you hire some people and learn what payroll is all about

You're a fucking idiot

Why don't you look past the end of your nose ...

You're looking only at the proximate event. You don't charge your customers for your employees taxes, your employees quit.

It's amazing that you get that you are going to charge your customers for your taxes, but you don't get that your employees are charging you for theirs. Amazing, and flat out ignorant.

So answer the question you evaded. You have two employees. A is worth 1 1/2 times B. Government taxes the money away from A. They are both going to take home the same pay and A is going to keep working for you, right?

And what employee, including you, looks at what they earn at the top of their check? They look at the dollars deposited in the bank, Holmes. Here's a dollar, buy a clue.

I'm starting to doubt you're a business owner given your apparent dearth of experience dealing with actual employees

 

[xband]

Can you explain the process? How are the greedy rich a-hole GOP taking the property of the "nonrich"?

Do they swoop in and steal their money? Of course not
They are too smart for that. The worker creates the wealth. The wealthy decide how it gets distributed

So none of the worker's property is actually taken from him. So what's the problem?

When you sell something, you still own it, right?

No you don't. If you sell something, you no longer own it.

You know I'm making fun of the left, right? Read the quotes in this post. When you hire a worker and pay them to produce something for you, they still own it, you're stealing from them!

Your statement is satire with a hint of irony. I love satire with a hint of irony.

 

[Skull Pilot]

So what? That still doesn't explain why so many people pay no federal income tax

Dude that EITC has been explained to you so many times I am starting to believe you are willfully stupid.

What good does that do you? Being willfully stupid that is.

You obviously can't grasp the question

Let me rephrase so you can understand

Why the fuck do some people get a fucking pass on the fucking income tax?

one can infer that the question also refers to the legitimacy of the fucking EITC

 

[kaz]

I'll answer when you tell me how many people has the lock on your door stopped from walking into your house?

I mean just the blood thirsty Canadians alone, they're just looking for a moment of weakness to pounce on us.

We don't need a military, wow. You're really not connected to the world. You need to read the news more often. Or ever.

I'll say it again you are the one that brought up military spending not me

I never once said we didn't need a military I said it does not protect our personal property. You are using the most abstract example possible to make your point

And I have given you examples of us actually being attacked but you say the attacks that never happened are more important.

You gave the examples of 9/11, where we kicked their asses, and Pearl Harbor, where we kicked their asses

But we didn't stop the attacks on our country. That's what you said the military does

You're an eight year old

What's the matter can't handle the truth

What's the matter, can't see past the end of your nose?

 

[Skull Pilot]

Have you ever even had an employee?

Not one employee has ever said I want you to pay my income taxes when we were discussing salary.

Income taxes are paid by the employee NOT the employer I don't know how many times I have to tell you this before it sinks in

And it's the gross salary and all it's related expenses that is passed on to customers not the income tax employees pay every week

SInce you don't know this because you obviously have never had to meet a payroll let me break it down for you

If I pay a person 50K a year that's 1923 a pay period

The employee has these amounts withheld

Federal tax 296
Social Security 119
Medicare 28

Then any state taxes

This is ALL paid from the employee's salary the employer does NOT pay these for his employees

The costs the employer bears is the matching social security and medicare contributions and state and federal unemployment taxes

As far as setting costs for services I only use the employee's gross pay and the FICA , SUTA and FUTA taxes as part of the calculation

So you see I do not use and no one uses the tax withholding of employees in cost of goods or services calculations

I'm going beyond your simplistic view of the world of who writes the check to the government. Wait a minute, you write the check ...

I write the check for MY taxes just like you do
Your employer does not write that check for you

really, you don't do your employee's tax withholdings? Don't call me when you're in jail, I'll just laugh at you

You're a fucking idiot

Why don't you hire some people and learn what payroll is all about

You're a fucking idiot

Why don't you look past the end of your nose ...

You're looking only at the proximate event. You don't charge your customers for your employees taxes, your employees quit.

It's amazing that you get that you are going to charge your customers for your taxes, but you don't get that your employees are charging you for theirs. Amazing, and flat out ignorant.

So answer the question you evaded. You have two employees. A is worth 1 1/2 times B. Government taxes the money away from A. They are both going to take home the same pay and A is going to keep working for you, right?

And what employee, including you, looks at what they earn at the top of their check? They look at the dollars deposited in the bank, Holmes. Here's a dollar, buy a clue.

I'm starting to doubt you're a business owner given your apparent dearth of experience dealing with actual employees

I already said I pass on the cost of their GROSS SALARY so what the fuck don't you understand about that you fucking moron

 

[kaz]

Do they swoop in and steal their money? Of course not
They are too smart for that. The worker creates the wealth. The wealthy decide how it gets distributed

So none of the worker's property is actually taken from him. So what's the problem?

When you sell something, you still own it, right?

No you don't. If you sell something, you no longer own it.

You know I'm making fun of the left, right? Read the quotes in this post. When you hire a worker and pay them to produce something for you, they still own it, you're stealing from them!

Your statement is satire with a hint of irony. I love satire with a hint of irony.

Is it? How so? Ironic because when I pay a worker to do something for me, I think I own it? Are you saying WTF, you don't!

 

[kaz]

I'm going beyond your simplistic view of the world of who writes the check to the government. Wait a minute, you write the check ...

I write the check for MY taxes just like you do
Your employer does not write that check for you

really, you don't do your employee's tax withholdings? Don't call me when you're in jail, I'll just laugh at you

You're a fucking idiot

Why don't you hire some people and learn what payroll is all about

You're a fucking idiot

Why don't you look past the end of your nose ...

You're looking only at the proximate event. You don't charge your customers for your employees taxes, your employees quit.

It's amazing that you get that you are going to charge your customers for your taxes, but you don't get that your employees are charging you for theirs. Amazing, and flat out ignorant.

So answer the question you evaded. You have two employees. A is worth 1 1/2 times B. Government taxes the money away from A. They are both going to take home the same pay and A is going to keep working for you, right?

And what employee, including you, looks at what they earn at the top of their check? They look at the dollars deposited in the bank, Holmes. Here's a dollar, buy a clue.

I'm starting to doubt you're a business owner given your apparent dearth of experience dealing with actual employees

I already said I pass on the cost of their GROSS SALARY so what the fuck don't you understand about that you fucking moron

I didn't see that. Did you say it to me?

OK, so going back to the start of the discussion on the fair tax that all taxes come out of the transaction, the sale of your company's goods, what's the problem?

You tax all transactions flatly and avoid all the downsides of taxing the same transactions 40 different ways (income taxes, corporate taxes, dividend taxes, capital gains taxes, taxing debt, repatriating money, payroll taxes, ...). That is the ultimate flat tax

 

[there4eyeM]

taxes should be in proportion to the benefit gained from the collective efforts of the society.

 

[xband]

So what? That still doesn't explain why so many people pay no federal income tax

Dude that EITC has been explained to you so many times I am starting to believe you are willfully stupid.

What good does that do you? Being willfully stupid that is.

You obviously can't grasp the question

Let me rephrase so you can understand

Why the fuck do some people get a fucking pass on the fucking income tax?

one can infer that the question also refers to the legitimacy of the fucking EITC

Some people get a pass on income tax legally like I do but I am near the top of the intelligence bell curve.

 

[Wilbur Right]

Why the fuck do some people get a fucking pass on the fucking income tax?

Man you are fucking stupid.

The congress under Ford gave us the EITC.
Reagan greatly expanded it.
And it has stayed with us all these years.
You don't like it? Take it up with your congress person.

You live in a fantasy world dude. Your constant bitch about having to pay taxes is tiresome.

Then you couple your tiresome complaints with stupid bullshit?
Wah wah I don't want to pay taxes. Wah wah I don't want to pay taxes.

Give it up dude. Or quit working.

 

[Skull Pilot]

So what? That still doesn't explain why so many people pay no federal income tax

Dude that EITC has been explained to you so many times I am starting to believe you are willfully stupid.

What good does that do you? Being willfully stupid that is.

You obviously can't grasp the question

Let me rephrase so you can understand

Why the fuck do some people get a fucking pass on the fucking income tax?

one can infer that the question also refers to the legitimacy of the fucking EITC

Some people get a pass on income tax legally like I do but I am near the top of the intelligence bell curve.

And the bottom of the earning curve

 

[kaz]

taxes should be in proportion to the benefit gained from the collective efforts of the society.

Taxes should be max 10% for all. Historically, that is the ideal rate. People are fine with paying them and do nothing to avoid them. They feel it's fair and work only to increase economic activity.

As taxes go up from there, people feel taxes are unfair and put more and more effort into avoiding taxes reducing taxable revenue and stifling economic activity. In the end, government never actually gets more actual money as they increase taxes from 10%.

Interestingly tithing is also the Christian solution. It's the same rate that is ideal across cultures and the world. There is something innate in humans that 10% overhead to pay for common services is fair