Freedom of Speech vs. Political Correctness

[jon_berzerk]

PC is freedom of speech. You people are a hoot.

why are you folks always so backwards

cold is hot

left is right

now pc is free speech

--LOL

PC is free speech

You say something that I find offensive, my freedom of speech says I get to say something about it

with pc speech you are not free to do so dummy

Of course you are

You can say any non-PC thing you want ....it is a free country
You can also be criticized for it....it is a free country

if you say it is NOT POLITICALLY CORRECT dummy

 

[jon_berzerk]

i know it is pretty humorous isnt it

--LOL

 

[Ravi]

Who said that? Oh, no one. You are just so afraid of saying something un-PC you need to make a strawman to protect you.

Saying something un-PC can destroy your career, as Mike Ditka recently learned.

Mike Ditka was a bigoted dick anyway
Karma is a bitch that way.

In other words, you're in favor of PC being used to destroy people. Disliking Obama is not proof that you're a bigot, and it's certainly not a valid reason for losing your job.

He didn't lose his job. You know what's worse than whining about PC? Lying.

Then why are all the news outlets saying he was?

Mike Ditka to be removed from ESPN's 'Sunday NFL Countdown,' website reports

Because they are also lying.

This new role is really a blessing. It’s something I asked for. After many years of weekend travel, I’m thrilled I’ll get to watch NFL games on Sundays and Monday nights in the comfort of my own home. I enjoy being part of the game and part of ESPN. I really do. So this is a great solution.

Mike Ditka Explains Why He's Leaving NFL Countdown For SportsCenter

 

[martybegan]

Not sure what your point is. Do you think speech should have consequences or not? If you don't like being told that you are offensive, then quit being offensive. Problem solved.

Ah, and you're in charge of determining what is "offensive".

And you'll try to issue consequences if I don't agree with your definition.

That's my point. Right there.
.

Yes. I am in charge of what is offensive.....for me. Just as you are in charge of that decision for you.

And I wouldn't think of issuing consequences if you said something I didn't like.

Too bad that courtesy won't be returned.
.

They either really don't get it, or they do get it and have decided to ignore their own inherent thuggery.

Talk it up, boys. Doesn't mean it won't cost you. Free speech can be very expensive...

And here is the thuggery, right on time.

 

[martybegan]

Bullshit.

He quit, even though the board of directors stood up for him. He is now the CEO of another company. The entire thing was probably his BS way of getting out of Mozilla as his business methods weren't approved of. Sucks to be you!

Figures you would spin it that way.

It's not spin, look it up.

Public proclamations aside, everyone knows what actually happened.

lol, I'm sure you do "know" as long as it confirms your bias.

you talking about someone else's bias is comical.

 

[martybegan]

Because the subject is absurd. There are always consequences to anything that is said. You whine about political correctness when what you really want is to deny free speech to people who disagree with your dumb remarks. Say what you want, but you have to expect what ever consequences.arise from what you say.

Why should there be "consequences", including and up to losing your job just for saying you think marriage should be between a man and a woman? Why should there be "consequences" just because you think illegal immigrants should be deported? Why should there be "consequences" because you think random college hookups between drunk people is not automatically rape if the woman decides later she doesn't like what happened?

So you don't believe in a private businesses right to run it as they see fit?

Rape? Talk about non sequitur...

Only if it's truly a private business.
Any business that serves the public is not private.

Seawytch is trying to get me into a trap about my concerns over businesses being forced to "bake or die".
This is actually two separate issues, one being government coercion and the other being coercion by the people.

. The cake decision has already been made. BAKE THE DAMN CAKE.
If you don't want offended people reacting, then quit being offensive.No more complicated than that.

'
So your view is "act like Bulldog wants you to act, think like bulldog wants you to think, OR ELSE"?

Thuggery pure and simple. You are now no better than those idiots who burned those "witches" in Salem.

Congrats.

 

[martybegan]

Because the subject is absurd. There are always consequences to anything that is said. You whine about political correctness when what you really want is to deny free speech to people who disagree with your dumb remarks. Say what you want, but you have to expect what ever consequences.arise from what you say.

Why should there be "consequences", including and up to losing your job just for saying you think marriage should be between a man and a woman? Why should there be "consequences" just because you think illegal immigrants should be deported? Why should there be "consequences" because you think random college hookups between drunk people is not automatically rape if the woman decides later she doesn't like what happened?

So you don't believe in a private businesses right to run it as they see fit?

Rape? Talk about non sequitur...

Only if it's truly a private business.
Any business that serves the public is not private.

Seawytch is trying to get me into a trap about my concerns over businesses being forced to "bake or die".
This is actually two separate issues, one being government coercion and the other being coercion by the people.

I see no coercion, a business that does business with the public can not and should not refuse Service to anyone due a philosophy.
Safety and health are a different issue.

You do see coercion, you just don't call it that because in these cases you agree with it.

At least stop lying to yourself and call a spade a spade.

 

[martybegan]

Bullshit.

He quit, even though the board of directors stood up for him. He is now the CEO of another company. The entire thing was probably his BS way of getting out of Mozilla as his business methods weren't approved of. Sucks to be you!

Figures you would spin it that way.

It's not spin, look it up.

Public proclamations aside, everyone knows what actually happened.

Argumentum ad populum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Not really. I'm not saying everyone agrees with the outcome, I'm saying Ravi's attempted deflection isn't fooling anyone.

 

[martybegan]

I believe that freedom of speech is our most important Constitutional right and that political correctness is its greatest adversary. The question is, who among our Presidential candidates will be its greatest defender?

The answer, obviously, is Donald Trump. You may not like his speech, but he is the embodiment of exercising that right. Ted Cruz makes good legal arguments, and the rest of the GOP candidates espouse conservative Constitutional principles, but Trump is the only one who puts his money where his mouth is.

Of course this "offends" those who want to control your speech, your thoughts and your money. Isn't it time we finally tell these people to "fuck off?"

PC has nothing to do with Freedom of Speech

Freedom of speech allows you to be criticized for the things you say. Trump also uses his freedom to criticize others

Since when does trying to ruin someone equal criticizing them back?

 

[Mac1958]

Ah, and you're in charge of determining what is "offensive".

And you'll try to issue consequences if I don't agree with your definition.

That's my point. Right there.
.

Yes. I am in charge of what is offensive.....for me. Just as you are in charge of that decision for you.

And I wouldn't think of issuing consequences if you said something I didn't like.

Too bad that courtesy won't be returned.
.

They either really don't get it, or they do get it and have decided to ignore their own inherent thuggery.

Talk it up, boys. Doesn't mean it won't cost you. Free speech can be very expensive...

And here is the thuggery, right on time.

At least they're up front about it.

You're gonna pay, tough shit, period.
.

 

[Valerie]

He quit, even though the board of directors stood up for him. He is now the CEO of another company. The entire thing was probably his BS way of getting out of Mozilla as his business methods weren't approved of. Sucks to be you!

Figures you would spin it that way.

It's not spin, look it up.

Public proclamations aside, everyone knows what actually happened.

lol, I'm sure you do "know" as long as it confirms your bias.

you talking about someone else's bias is comical.

how so, marty? what do you mean by saying that?

 

[martybegan]

Because the subject is absurd. There are always consequences to anything that is said. You whine about political correctness when what you really want is to deny free speech to people who disagree with your dumb remarks. Say what you want, but you have to expect what ever consequences.arise from what you say.

Why should there be "consequences", including and up to losing your job just for saying you think marriage should be between a man and a woman? Why should there be "consequences" just because you think illegal immigrants should be deported? Why should there be "consequences" because you think random college hookups between drunk people is not automatically rape if the woman decides later she doesn't like what happened?

So you don't believe in a private businesses right to run it as they see fit?

Rape? Talk about non sequitur...

Only if it's truly a private business.
Any business that serves the public is not private.

Seawytch is trying to get me into a trap about my concerns over businesses being forced to "bake or die".
This is actually two separate issues, one being government coercion and the other being coercion by the people.

And apparently you're opposed to both...

I'm opposed to people being forced to go against their beliefs simply because someone's feelings are hurt, and because they are a protected class, their butthurt is more equal than the other parties butthurt.

 

[Valerie]

Trump, Mr. Bring suit against anyone who speaks against him, Mr. Throw out of the people in my rally who do not agree with me, is the embodiment of free speech???

Surely you are kidding....?

right

 

[martybegan]

Because the subject is absurd. There are always consequences to anything that is said. You whine about political correctness when what you really want is to deny free speech to people who disagree with your dumb remarks. Say what you want, but you have to expect what ever consequences.arise from what you say.

Why should there be "consequences", including and up to losing your job just for saying you think marriage should be between a man and a woman? Why should there be "consequences" just because you think illegal immigrants should be deported? Why should there be "consequences" because you think random college hookups between drunk people is not automatically rape if the woman decides later she doesn't like what happened?

There are always consequences to anything that is said. asking why is as dumb as asking why the sun comes up in the East. It just is. Live with it.

Screw that. the problem is people have become hypersensitive, and just cant stand that other can have opposing views than they do. The proper response to speech you don't like is 1) disagreeing with the person 2)disagreeing and arguing your point or 3) disagreeing and telling the person to piss off. The proper response is not trying to ruin them, or trying to silence them, or trying to intimidate them into silence.

It's terrible when government does it, and not much better when other people do it.

Those on the political left are ignoring this important fact

They'll continue to. They don't want to give this tactic up. Too effective, still.
.

By making people scared to voice their opinion if it goes against the progressive mantra using bully tactics and such, they have found a way to silence people without even getting the government involved. So they can yammer on about it "not being censorship" while they get the same end result of government censorship.

 

[martybegan]

He quit, even though the board of directors stood up for him. He is now the CEO of another company. The entire thing was probably his BS way of getting out of Mozilla as his business methods weren't approved of. Sucks to be you!

Figures you would spin it that way.

It's not spin, look it up.

Public proclamations aside, everyone knows what actually happened.

lol, I'm sure you do "know" as long as it confirms your bias.

you talking about someone else's bias is comical.

how so, marty? what do you mean by saying that?

That Ravi is just as biased as anyone else when it comes to their view.

 

[Mac1958]

Why should there be "consequences", including and up to losing your job just for saying you think marriage should be between a man and a woman? Why should there be "consequences" just because you think illegal immigrants should be deported? Why should there be "consequences" because you think random college hookups between drunk people is not automatically rape if the woman decides later she doesn't like what happened?

There are always consequences to anything that is said. asking why is as dumb as asking why the sun comes up in the East. It just is. Live with it.

Screw that. the problem is people have become hypersensitive, and just cant stand that other can have opposing views than they do. The proper response to speech you don't like is 1) disagreeing with the person 2)disagreeing and arguing your point or 3) disagreeing and telling the person to piss off. The proper response is not trying to ruin them, or trying to silence them, or trying to intimidate them into silence.

It's terrible when government does it, and not much better when other people do it.

Those on the political left are ignoring this important fact

They'll continue to. They don't want to give this tactic up. Too effective, still.
.

By making people scared to voice their opinion if it goes against the progressive mantra using bully tactics and such, they have found a way to silence people without even getting the government involved. So they can yammer on about it "not being censorship" while they get the same end result of government censorship.

That's why the lovely lady (and proud, lifelong Democrat) in my sig calls them "illiberal".

These are not traditional liberals, they're a distortion.
.

 

[Valerie]

That Ravi is just as biased as anyone else when it comes to their view.

bullshit. it's not her fault you're just too scared to be yourself...

 

[martybegan]

Because the subject is absurd. There are always consequences to anything that is said. You whine about political correctness when what you really want is to deny free speech to people who disagree with your dumb remarks. Say what you want, but you have to expect what ever consequences.arise from what you say.

Why should there be "consequences", including and up to losing your job just for saying you think marriage should be between a man and a woman? Why should there be "consequences" just because you think illegal immigrants should be deported? Why should there be "consequences" because you think random college hookups between drunk people is not automatically rape if the woman decides later she doesn't like what happened?

There are always consequences to anything that is said. asking why is as dumb as asking why the sun comes up in the East. It just is. Live with it.

Screw that. the problem is people have become hypersensitive, and just cant stand that other can have opposing views than they do. The proper response to speech you don't like is 1) disagreeing with the person 2)disagreeing and arguing your point or 3) disagreeing and telling the person to piss off. The proper response is not trying to ruin them, or trying to silence them, or trying to intimidate them into silence.

It's terrible when government does it, and not much better when other people do it.

Those on the political left are ignoring this important fact

Another thing they do is this: If you defend the right of a bigot to say something bigoted, then you must agree with that bigot.

Now, I honestly don't know if they actually believe that, or if it's just another dishonest tactic, I can never tell with them.

Who knows. But if they're being serious, that's some pretty simplistic thinking right there.
.

Deep down inside every progressive is a person so unsure of themselves that they can't deal with opposing opinions, so they have to either silence them or make them into something evil to be destroyed.

 

[Mac1958]

Why should there be "consequences", including and up to losing your job just for saying you think marriage should be between a man and a woman? Why should there be "consequences" just because you think illegal immigrants should be deported? Why should there be "consequences" because you think random college hookups between drunk people is not automatically rape if the woman decides later she doesn't like what happened?

There are always consequences to anything that is said. asking why is as dumb as asking why the sun comes up in the East. It just is. Live with it.

Screw that. the problem is people have become hypersensitive, and just cant stand that other can have opposing views than they do. The proper response to speech you don't like is 1) disagreeing with the person 2)disagreeing and arguing your point or 3) disagreeing and telling the person to piss off. The proper response is not trying to ruin them, or trying to silence them, or trying to intimidate them into silence.

It's terrible when government does it, and not much better when other people do it.

Those on the political left are ignoring this important fact

Another thing they do is this: If you defend the right of a bigot to say something bigoted, then you must agree with that bigot.

Now, I honestly don't know if they actually believe that, or if it's just another dishonest tactic, I can never tell with them.

Who knows. But if they're being serious, that's some pretty simplistic thinking right there.
.

Deep down inside every progressive is a person so unsure of themselves that they can't deal with opposing opinions, so they have to either silence them or make them into something evil to be destroyed.

Yeah, I do wonder about that.

If you're truly confident in your position and your ability to communicate it, you're not afraid of opposing opinions.
.

 

[martybegan]

There are always consequences to anything that is said. asking why is as dumb as asking why the sun comes up in the East. It just is. Live with it.

Screw that. the problem is people have become hypersensitive, and just cant stand that other can have opposing views than they do. The proper response to speech you don't like is 1) disagreeing with the person 2)disagreeing and arguing your point or 3) disagreeing and telling the person to piss off. The proper response is not trying to ruin them, or trying to silence them, or trying to intimidate them into silence.

It's terrible when government does it, and not much better when other people do it.

Those on the political left are ignoring this important fact

They'll continue to. They don't want to give this tactic up. Too effective, still.
.

By making people scared to voice their opinion if it goes against the progressive mantra using bully tactics and such, they have found a way to silence people without even getting the government involved. So they can yammer on about it "not being censorship" while they get the same end result of government censorship.

That's why the lovely lady (and proud, lifelong Democrat) in my sig calls them "illiberal".

These are not traditional liberals, they're a distortion.
.

thats why I call them progressives, or usually progressive statists.

Their mantra: "my ideas are the best ideas, but you don't agree so here's a dose of government or a dose of media frenzy shaming to either force you to submit, or ruin you enough so you can't do any harm"