Muslims are our friends but Islam is the enemy of Western Civilization?

[Kalam]

and insure only allah is worshiped

No.

So you believe allah was wrong .
according to all these Islamic scholars
OTay.

Where does Ibn Kathir or any scholar state that all non-Muslims must be killed?

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

Islamic Verdicts Regarding Those Who Mock Islm and Its Followers

 

[Kalam]

I'm sorry; that link does not lead to any scholar calling for the sort of genocide of nonbelievers that you insist is demanded by Islam.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

No.

So you believe allah was wrong .
according to all these Islamic scholars
OTay.

Where does Ibn Kathir or any scholar state that all non-Muslims must be killed?

Well it doesn't, it just tells muslims to fight until only muslims remain.
So there is a difference, but no daylight.

 

[Kalam]

Well it doesn't, it just tells muslims to fight until only muslims remain.

Does it?

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

Well it doesn't, it just tells muslims to fight until only muslims remain.

Does it?

Yes.

 

[Kalam]

Well it doesn't, it just tells muslims to fight until only muslims remain.

Does it?

Yes.

Go on...

 

[Foxfyre]

So how does that square with there being multiple meanings for jihad? And how does one discern which meaning applies in any given passage?

The word doesn't have multiple meanings; it literally denotes striving and refers in religious contexts to any effort made for the sake of Allah (SWT). My point was that this term includes a far broader range of actions than the posted interpretation implies.

And how does one discern which meaning applies in any given passage?

By examining the scriptural and historical context of the passage in question. Did you have any in mind?

No, not any specific passage at this time. We've looked a numerous ones over the course of this thread. So what you are saying is that the Qu'ran is interpreted within its historical context just as Jews interpret the Torah within its historical context and the Christians interpret their Bible within its historical context.

And that would absolutely contradict Sunniman's explanation of that.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

My word on the topic of Islam is good enough .
If you disagree with me , you disagree with the "Prophet"

 

[Kalam]

My word on the topic of Islam is good enough .
If you disagree with me , you disagree with the "Prophet"

Too funny.

 

[Ropey]

And that would absolutely contradict Sunniman's explanation of that.

Don't be too sure that it doesn't Foxfyre. Kalam is pretty enlightened...

 

[Kalam]

No, not any specific passage at this time. We've looked a numerous ones over the course of this thread. So what you are saying is that the Qu'ran is interpreted within its historical context just as Jews interpret the Torah within its historical context and the Christians interpret their Bible within its historical context.

And that would absolutely contradict Sunniman's explanation of that.

Hmm... I didn't read Sunni Man's post myself, but I doubt we've completely contradicted each other. I'll browse the thread for it.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

My word on the topic of Islam is good enough .
If you disagree with me , you disagree with the "Prophet"

Too funny.

Isn't it?
That is why you are always quoting scripture... and linking to scripture and ..... and what?

What is it you do exactly ?

Oh yeah say....., I dont know anything about Islam.

Well lets say I dont know anything about Islam .Lets start there..




You explain what part of this statement you disagree with

“Jihad is holy fighting in Allah’s Cause with full force of numbers and weaponry. It is given the utmost importance in Islam and is one of its pillars. By Jihad Islam is established,

Allah’s Word is made superior (which means only Allah has the right to be worshiped), and Islam is propagated. By abandoning Jihad Islam is destroyed and Muslims fall into an inferior position; their honor is lost, their lands are stolen, their rule and authority vanish.

Jihad is an obligatory duty in Islam on every Muslim. He who tries to escape from this duty, or does not fulfill this duty, dies as a hypocrite.”

 

[gautama]

My word on the topic of Islam is good enough .
If you disagree with me , you disagree with the "Prophet"

Too funny.

Isn't it?
That is why you are always quoting scripture... and linking to scripture and ..... and what?

What is it you do exactly ?

Oh yeah say....., I dont know anything about Islam.

Well lets say I dont know anything about Islam .Lets start there..




You explain what part of this statement you disagree with

“Jihad is holy fighting in Allah’s Cause with full force of numbers and weaponry. It is given the utmost importance in Islam and is one of its pillars. By Jihad Islam is established,

Allah’s Word is made superior (which means only Allah has the right to be worshiped), and Islam is propagated. By abandoning Jihad Islam is destroyed and Muslims fall into an inferior position; their honor is lost, their lands are stolen, their rule and authority vanish.

Jihad is an obligatory duty in Islam on every Muslim. He who tries to escape from this duty, or does not fulfill this duty, dies as a hypocrite.”

Bottom Line: Unquestionably, Fitnah is clobbering the crap outa the two Muslim arseholes Sunni Bitch and Kalam Shazam using their Ridiculous Qu'ran, and their own Muslim Scholars to do this.

And, in this process, Fitnah is proving beyond a nanogram of a doubt that the Historically Documented Psycho, the MASS MURDERER, THIEF, and PEDOPHILIC RAPIST Mohammed, and his Flawed concoction of SUPREMACIST BULLSHIT, THE LUDICROUS QU'RAN, are simply a GARGANTUAN Mt. EVEREST of UNMITIGATED & UNADULTERATED......CAMELSHIT !!!

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

Im sure Mr Kalam Man and Mr Sunni bBitch are having the interwebnet outrage.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

Outage

 

[Ropey]

My word on the topic of Islam is good enough .
If you disagree with me , you disagree with the "Prophet"

Too funny.

Isn't it?
That is why you are always quoting scripture... and linking to scripture and ..... and what?

What is it you do exactly ?

Oh yeah say....., I dont know anything about Islam.

Well lets say I dont know anything about Islam .Lets start there..




You explain what part of this statement you disagree with

“Jihad is holy fighting in Allah’s Cause with full force of numbers and weaponry. It is given the utmost importance in Islam and is one of its pillars. By Jihad Islam is established,

Allah’s Word is made superior (which means only Allah has the right to be worshiped), and Islam is propagated. By abandoning Jihad Islam is destroyed and Muslims fall into an inferior position; their honor is lost, their lands are stolen, their rule and authority vanish.

Jihad is an obligatory duty in Islam on every Muslim. He who tries to escape from this duty, or does not fulfill this duty, dies as a hypocrite.”

He's already told you Mr. Fitnah.

Kalam's interpretation of Jihad is too complex to assign any single label of event to such a thing and claim that is all it means. I've talked with him before.

Jihad to one interpretation is holy war in a physical sense. This is why so many die on Islam's holiest days. That interpretation predates any attack on Islam.

But, there's no fighting Kalams extension logically Mr. Fitnah. It passes the logic tables for truth in that it can not be disproven and it can be broken down to a simple equation.

Jihad, defined as a human struggle on a spiritual journey to bring peace to the human soul and which is [at this point in time] being interpreted (by some) as a physical journey in which a physical defeat of <insert ideological NOT spiritual path>.

I use the realities of what happens today to temper my own interpretations of what the hay is going on right now.

And this is where I believe the above interpretation on a spiritual level loses. It loses to the reality on the ground at this moment.

The word peace to Western philosophy is not that complicated. Islam has another meaning for peace. They are not the same. It is made complicated to disguise its real meaning.

Islam is peace by Islamic terms.

Peace in Islam is to be free from war. Free from war is to submit to the natural will of Allah.

To be at peace is to be under the will of Muslims who submit to the will of Allah. In other words, when the world is under the will of Allah and all Muslims submitting to Allah with all others under the will of those Muslims, then the world is under peace.

We won't get into what happens to those who are under the will of those who are submitting to Allah.

Other than that, the definitions change due to ideologies, and you could argue with Kalam all night and day, but you could not do more than counter with the reality of today which is countered by the view is that the interpretation is at fault, not the book.

There's no win here. Not in the sense of the ebb and flow in multi generational movements of man. It has its own life and we are simply holding on. Every once and a while an anomaly pops up and the quick catch it.

Which is what I said at the beginning of this thread. There's no master plan. Yes, there's a militant side to Islam. There was to Judaism. There was (and in some places is) to Christianity.

But that doesn't discount that the problem is the interpretation. One must needs visit the side that is prominent at this time and not the enlightened interpretation which is belied by all the Islamic violence in the world.

So, that's why I stay in the reality of the moment. It's all we have until we are gone.

We can see what is happening in the moment. If I move into my head and focus on spiritual enlightenment.

Then I want my ass protected.

That has much meaning to me!

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

Then I want my ass protected.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvTElEQICeI[/ame]

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

I just realized Ive talked to thatr guy on the phone.

Im much better looking.

 

[gautama]

Outage

Actually...... both.