"What is the Democrats' message?"

[Correll]

That's what happens when a political majority that is rapidly losing its demographic influence Gerrymanders its way in to power in spite of those demographics, and tries to drag a democratic society in a direction that it does not want to go.

It's also what happens when the greedy haves in a society buy up as much political influence among said rapidly diminishing majority for the sole purpose of concentrating as much wealth and resources as possible in to as few hands as possible before the wheels inevitably fall off.

The fact that both of those things occurred in coordination with each other makes America 2018 all the more entertaining.

Bear in mind that what we are witnessing is a long-game by conservatives, led by the Christian right, to consolidate undue power beginning in the early 1970's when they saw that the pathway to maintaining national power in spite of the demographic changes favoring the tolerance and protection of America's freaks and weirdos was through the state legislatures and local elections.

Shame The Devil and tell the truth, it was a well played long-term political strategy, but even the guys who conceived of it probably predicted the wheels would eventually fall off. Just goes to show how personal agendas and personal profit can be put ahead of democracy, country and society

Agreed.

I do think what has made this far worse for them in the long run is the introduction of those voices who have completely led them astray, convincing them that giving an inch or even communicating equates to abject surrender, capitulation. Their very thought processes have literally been changed over the last 30 years, to the point where I believe them when they say they don't know what to do.
.

Your primary advice is to continue to destroy any republicans even accused of racism.


That,

A, destroys good people and loses elections and offices that we can't afford to lose.

and


B. supports the bullshit myth of the GOP as the party of racism.

Okay, just throwing it out there. The plan appears to be to do nothing different, so we'll see how that works out.
.

All of this is taking place without any input from republicans. We have no input into the process.


We are on the outside. We can shout the Truth from the roof tops, but we can't make people listen.

That depends on how you shout the "Truth". If you feel you've done all you can, okay. We'll see how it goes.
.

You've stated that policy RESULTS, such as improved jobs and quality of life is irrelevant.


So, really, it isn't about us. We have no input.

 

[Mac1958]

Agreed.

I do think what has made this far worse for them in the long run is the introduction of those voices who have completely led them astray, convincing them that giving an inch or even communicating equates to abject surrender, capitulation. Their very thought processes have literally been changed over the last 30 years, to the point where I believe them when they say they don't know what to do.
.

Your primary advice is to continue to destroy any republicans even accused of racism.


That,

A, destroys good people and loses elections and offices that we can't afford to lose.

and


B. supports the bullshit myth of the GOP as the party of racism.

Okay, just throwing it out there. The plan appears to be to do nothing different, so we'll see how that works out.
.

All of this is taking place without any input from republicans. We have no input into the process.


We are on the outside. We can shout the Truth from the roof tops, but we can't make people listen.

That depends on how you shout the "Truth". If you feel you've done all you can, okay. We'll see how it goes.
.

You've stated that policy RESULTS, such as improved jobs and quality of life is irrelevant.


So, really, it isn't about us. We have no input.

I've explained the problem: This is personal. And I laid out a start in post 201. That would be input, it would be very welcome, but the GOP will CHOOSE not to do it.

Life is full of choices. That's up to you. But not choosing to not do something is still your choice.
.

 

[Correll]

Your primary advice is to continue to destroy any republicans even accused of racism.


That,

A, destroys good people and loses elections and offices that we can't afford to lose.

and


B. supports the bullshit myth of the GOP as the party of racism.

Okay, just throwing it out there. The plan appears to be to do nothing different, so we'll see how that works out.
.

All of this is taking place without any input from republicans. We have no input into the process.


We are on the outside. We can shout the Truth from the roof tops, but we can't make people listen.

That depends on how you shout the "Truth". If you feel you've done all you can, okay. We'll see how it goes.
.

You've stated that policy RESULTS, such as improved jobs and quality of life is irrelevant.


So, really, it isn't about us. We have no input.

I've explained the problem: This is personal. And I laid out a start in post 201. That would be input, it would be very welcome, but the GOP will CHOOSE not to do it.

Life is full of choices. That's up to you. But not choosing to not do something is still your choice.
.

So, step one, declare war on our most successful spokesmen.


In doing so, we not only marginalize and offends our base, but we SUPPORT the lie that we are the party of racism.


We need to counter and destroy that lie, not support it.


People like McCain have tried your path. They fail. All the time.


This is not about us. We have no input. We are shut out.

 

[Mac1958]

Okay, just throwing it out there. The plan appears to be to do nothing different, so we'll see how that works out.
.

All of this is taking place without any input from republicans. We have no input into the process.


We are on the outside. We can shout the Truth from the roof tops, but we can't make people listen.

That depends on how you shout the "Truth". If you feel you've done all you can, okay. We'll see how it goes.
.

You've stated that policy RESULTS, such as improved jobs and quality of life is irrelevant.


So, really, it isn't about us. We have no input.

I've explained the problem: This is personal. And I laid out a start in post 201. That would be input, it would be very welcome, but the GOP will CHOOSE not to do it.

Life is full of choices. That's up to you. But not choosing to not do something is still your choice.
.

So, step one, declare war on our most successful spokesmen.


In doing so, we not only marginalize and offends our base, but we SUPPORT the lie that we are the party of racism.


We need to counter and destroy that lie, not support it.


People like McCain have tried your path. They fail. All the time.


This is not about us. We have no input. We are shut out.

Okay then, here it comes. I sure wouldn't just stand there and take it, but okay.
.

 

[Redfish]

And lesson for dummies red
Were China to want to match Trump’s latest threat, it wouldn’t have enough American goods imports to target. It could take other measures like curbing package tours or student transfers to the U.S., or hamper American companies operating in China.

“This is starting to feel like the beginnings of a trade war, if simply each proposal is matched with a retaliation,” said Patrick Bennett, a Hong Kong-based strategist at Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce. “The U.S. risks isolating itself from global trade in this process and we think the U.S., USD and U.S. asset markets have more to lose.”

we would win a trade war and china would lose. previous presidents have allowed china to win and help put this country in huge debt to china, Trump is trying to reverse that.

We don't need Chinese products to survive, but they need American food to survive. We have all the leverage here to stop the unfair advantage they have had for far too long.

how do you win a trade war, trump loon? and how do you think you're better able to gauge the effects of a trade war than actual smart people who are trained in economics.

hint: you can't.

OK, jelly. does china sell more to America or does America sell more to china? Hint: the country selling the most has the most to lose in a trade war.

we all know america sells only about 154 billion to china and most of the meat planes etc are targeted at red states And imo the chinese citizen is far more adept at living in pain than even redstate crackers

those products will be sold to US markets. there is no pain involved, dingleberry.

 

[Correll]

All of this is taking place without any input from republicans. We have no input into the process.


We are on the outside. We can shout the Truth from the roof tops, but we can't make people listen.

That depends on how you shout the "Truth". If you feel you've done all you can, okay. We'll see how it goes.
.

You've stated that policy RESULTS, such as improved jobs and quality of life is irrelevant.


So, really, it isn't about us. We have no input.

I've explained the problem: This is personal. And I laid out a start in post 201. That would be input, it would be very welcome, but the GOP will CHOOSE not to do it.

Life is full of choices. That's up to you. But not choosing to not do something is still your choice.
.

So, step one, declare war on our most successful spokesmen.


In doing so, we not only marginalize and offends our base, but we SUPPORT the lie that we are the party of racism.


We need to counter and destroy that lie, not support it.


People like McCain have tried your path. They fail. All the time.


This is not about us. We have no input. We are shut out.

Okay then, here it comes. I sure wouldn't just stand there and take it, but okay.
.

It is not nice of you to blame the victim.


That type of rubbing salt in the wounds, will only make things worse.

Nor is it reasonable to call dismiss what we are doing.


But the internal workings of the minority perspective, is beyond our control. We have no input.

 

[Redfish]

And lesson for dummies red
Were China to want to match Trump’s latest threat, it wouldn’t have enough American goods imports to target. It could take other measures like curbing package tours or student transfers to the U.S., or hamper American companies operating in China.

“This is starting to feel like the beginnings of a trade war, if simply each proposal is matched with a retaliation,” said Patrick Bennett, a Hong Kong-based strategist at Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce. “The U.S. risks isolating itself from global trade in this process and we think the U.S., USD and U.S. asset markets have more to lose.”

we would win a trade war and china would lose. previous presidents have allowed china to win and help put this country in huge debt to china, Trump is trying to reverse that.

We don't need Chinese products to survive, but they need American food to survive. We have all the leverage here to stop the unfair advantage they have had for far too long.

how do you win a trade war, trump loon? and how do you think you're better able to gauge the effects of a trade war than actual smart people who are trained in economics.

hint: you can't.

OK, jelly. does china sell more to America or does America sell more to china? Hint: the country selling the most has the most to lose in a trade war.

The education of redfish
Why China’s soybean tariffs matter
April 5, 2018 6.46am EDT
A farmer harvest his soybean field in Loami, Ill. AP Photo/Seth Perlman
Aut
China’s plan to levy a 25 percent tariff on imports of U.S. soybeans may come as something of a surprise to most Americans. But to a professor of agricultural economics who studies international commodity markets for a living, this was not at all unexpected.

Even before the conclusion of the 2016 presidential race, trade analysts were already weighing the possibility that China might impose an embargo on U.S. soybean imports based on protectionist rhetoric from both candidates.

And now that risk of a trade war is reality, and American soybean farmers may be among the biggest losers.

Soybeans are a crucial part of the global food chain, particularly as a source of protein in the production of hogs and poultry.

In 2016, the U.S. accounted for US$22.8 billion worth of global soybean exports, the most of any country. Its nearest competitor is Brazil, which exported $21 billion.


Meanwhile, China accounts for the lion’s share of global soybean imports at $34 billion, or two-thirds of the total.

American exports made up about a third of that, or $12.4 billion, making soybeans the United States’ second-most valuable export to China after varieties of airplanes.


The importance of China as a market for soybeans has been driven by an explosion in demand for meat as consumers switch from a diet dominated by rice to one where pork, poultry and beef play an important part. Chinese production of meat from those three animals surged 250 percent from 1986 to 2012 and is projected to increase another 30 percent by the end of the current decade. However, China is unable to produce enough animal feed itself, hence the need to import soybeans from the United States and Brazil.

That’s why the tariffs have tremendous potential to hurt farmers here in Ohio, where soybeans are the number one agricultural export at $1.4 billion. China is the state’s largest export market.

And Ohio is just the sixth-largest exporter of soybeans, after Illinois, Iowa, Minnesota, Indiana and Nebraska, all of which will suffer from the tariffs.

Not only do farmers stand to lose out by giving up market share to Brazilian farmers, but soybean prices will probably fall as well, hurting incomes and creating a double whammy for Midwest farms.

so those farmers my have to grow something else to sell in the US market. Its called adapting to change and dealing with reality. the government is not responsible to guaranty any market for US farmers.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

And lesson for dummies red
Were China to want to match Trump’s latest threat, it wouldn’t have enough American goods imports to target. It could take other measures like curbing package tours or student transfers to the U.S., or hamper American companies operating in China.

“This is starting to feel like the beginnings of a trade war, if simply each proposal is matched with a retaliation,” said Patrick Bennett, a Hong Kong-based strategist at Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce. “The U.S. risks isolating itself from global trade in this process and we think the U.S., USD and U.S. asset markets have more to lose.”

we would win a trade war and china would lose. previous presidents have allowed china to win and help put this country in huge debt to china, Trump is trying to reverse that.

We don't need Chinese products to survive, but they need American food to survive. We have all the leverage here to stop the unfair advantage they have had for far too long.

how do you win a trade war, trump loon? and how do you think you're better able to gauge the effects of a trade war than actual smart people who are trained in economics.

hint: you can't.

OK, jelly. does china sell more to America or does America sell more to china? Hint: the country selling the most has the most to lose in a trade war.

we all know america sells only about 154 billion to china and most of the meat planes etc are targeted at red states And imo the chinese citizen is far more adept at living in pain than even redstate crackers

those products will be sold to US markets. there is no pain involved, dingleberry.

They will be sold in US markets. At what pricepoint?

 

[Hutch Starskey]

And lesson for dummies red
Were China to want to match Trump’s latest threat, it wouldn’t have enough American goods imports to target. It could take other measures like curbing package tours or student transfers to the U.S., or hamper American companies operating in China.

“This is starting to feel like the beginnings of a trade war, if simply each proposal is matched with a retaliation,” said Patrick Bennett, a Hong Kong-based strategist at Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce. “The U.S. risks isolating itself from global trade in this process and we think the U.S., USD and U.S. asset markets have more to lose.”

we would win a trade war and china would lose. previous presidents have allowed china to win and help put this country in huge debt to china, Trump is trying to reverse that.

We don't need Chinese products to survive, but they need American food to survive. We have all the leverage here to stop the unfair advantage they have had for far too long.

how do you win a trade war, trump loon? and how do you think you're better able to gauge the effects of a trade war than actual smart people who are trained in economics.

hint: you can't.

OK, jelly. does china sell more to America or does America sell more to china? Hint: the country selling the most has the most to lose in a trade war.

The education of redfish
Why China’s soybean tariffs matter
April 5, 2018 6.46am EDT
A farmer harvest his soybean field in Loami, Ill. AP Photo/Seth Perlman
Aut
China’s plan to levy a 25 percent tariff on imports of U.S. soybeans may come as something of a surprise to most Americans. But to a professor of agricultural economics who studies international commodity markets for a living, this was not at all unexpected.

Even before the conclusion of the 2016 presidential race, trade analysts were already weighing the possibility that China might impose an embargo on U.S. soybean imports based on protectionist rhetoric from both candidates.

And now that risk of a trade war is reality, and American soybean farmers may be among the biggest losers.

Soybeans are a crucial part of the global food chain, particularly as a source of protein in the production of hogs and poultry.

In 2016, the U.S. accounted for US$22.8 billion worth of global soybean exports, the most of any country. Its nearest competitor is Brazil, which exported $21 billion.


Meanwhile, China accounts for the lion’s share of global soybean imports at $34 billion, or two-thirds of the total.

American exports made up about a third of that, or $12.4 billion, making soybeans the United States’ second-most valuable export to China after varieties of airplanes.


The importance of China as a market for soybeans has been driven by an explosion in demand for meat as consumers switch from a diet dominated by rice to one where pork, poultry and beef play an important part. Chinese production of meat from those three animals surged 250 percent from 1986 to 2012 and is projected to increase another 30 percent by the end of the current decade. However, China is unable to produce enough animal feed itself, hence the need to import soybeans from the United States and Brazil.

That’s why the tariffs have tremendous potential to hurt farmers here in Ohio, where soybeans are the number one agricultural export at $1.4 billion. China is the state’s largest export market.

And Ohio is just the sixth-largest exporter of soybeans, after Illinois, Iowa, Minnesota, Indiana and Nebraska, all of which will suffer from the tariffs.

Not only do farmers stand to lose out by giving up market share to Brazilian farmers, but soybean prices will probably fall as well, hurting incomes and creating a double whammy for Midwest farms.

so those farmers my have to grow something else to sell in the US market. Its called adapting to change and dealing with reality. the government is not responsible to guaranty any market for US farmers.

so those farmers my have to grow something else to sell in the US market. Its called adapting to change and dealing with reality. the government is not responsible to guaranty any market for US farmers.

So then. Tell us some more about Obama's "war on coal" and why it was so awful.

 

[Redfish]

And lesson for dummies red
Were China to want to match Trump’s latest threat, it wouldn’t have enough American goods imports to target. It could take other measures like curbing package tours or student transfers to the U.S., or hamper American companies operating in China.

“This is starting to feel like the beginnings of a trade war, if simply each proposal is matched with a retaliation,” said Patrick Bennett, a Hong Kong-based strategist at Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce. “The U.S. risks isolating itself from global trade in this process and we think the U.S., USD and U.S. asset markets have more to lose.”

we would win a trade war and china would lose. previous presidents have allowed china to win and help put this country in huge debt to china, Trump is trying to reverse that.

We don't need Chinese products to survive, but they need American food to survive. We have all the leverage here to stop the unfair advantage they have had for far too long.

how do you win a trade war, trump loon? and how do you think you're better able to gauge the effects of a trade war than actual smart people who are trained in economics.

hint: you can't.

OK, jelly. does china sell more to America or does America sell more to china? Hint: the country selling the most has the most to lose in a trade war.

Great. Losing anything is putting us worse off then before, fool. Rising prices will negate any gains made through tax cuts.

So to recap, Trump gave us deficit expanding tax cuts and then created artificial inflation that swallows up those gains. He's raised our national debt considerably for no gains.
Brilliant!

Do you understand that American jobs are impacted when a foreign country sells the same product for less than the US companies? Tariffs just put US companies on an equal footing with their foreign competitors. Do you think its fair that Germany puts a 100% tariff on Harley Davidson motorcycles sold in Germany? But we don't put tariffs on Mercedes or BMWs?

 

[Redfish]

we would win a trade war and china would lose. previous presidents have allowed china to win and help put this country in huge debt to china, Trump is trying to reverse that.

We don't need Chinese products to survive, but they need American food to survive. We have all the leverage here to stop the unfair advantage they have had for far too long.

how do you win a trade war, trump loon? and how do you think you're better able to gauge the effects of a trade war than actual smart people who are trained in economics.

hint: you can't.

OK, jelly. does china sell more to America or does America sell more to china? Hint: the country selling the most has the most to lose in a trade war.

we all know america sells only about 154 billion to china and most of the meat planes etc are targeted at red states And imo the chinese citizen is far more adept at living in pain than even redstate crackers

those products will be sold to US markets. there is no pain involved, dingleberry.

They will be sold in US markets. At what pricepoint?

equal or less than the foreign products. so the consumer decides based on quality, not price.

 

[Redfish]

we would win a trade war and china would lose. previous presidents have allowed china to win and help put this country in huge debt to china, Trump is trying to reverse that.

We don't need Chinese products to survive, but they need American food to survive. We have all the leverage here to stop the unfair advantage they have had for far too long.

how do you win a trade war, trump loon? and how do you think you're better able to gauge the effects of a trade war than actual smart people who are trained in economics.

hint: you can't.

OK, jelly. does china sell more to America or does America sell more to china? Hint: the country selling the most has the most to lose in a trade war.

The education of redfish
Why China’s soybean tariffs matter
April 5, 2018 6.46am EDT
A farmer harvest his soybean field in Loami, Ill. AP Photo/Seth Perlman
Aut
China’s plan to levy a 25 percent tariff on imports of U.S. soybeans may come as something of a surprise to most Americans. But to a professor of agricultural economics who studies international commodity markets for a living, this was not at all unexpected.

Even before the conclusion of the 2016 presidential race, trade analysts were already weighing the possibility that China might impose an embargo on U.S. soybean imports based on protectionist rhetoric from both candidates.

And now that risk of a trade war is reality, and American soybean farmers may be among the biggest losers.

Soybeans are a crucial part of the global food chain, particularly as a source of protein in the production of hogs and poultry.

In 2016, the U.S. accounted for US$22.8 billion worth of global soybean exports, the most of any country. Its nearest competitor is Brazil, which exported $21 billion.


Meanwhile, China accounts for the lion’s share of global soybean imports at $34 billion, or two-thirds of the total.

American exports made up about a third of that, or $12.4 billion, making soybeans the United States’ second-most valuable export to China after varieties of airplanes.


The importance of China as a market for soybeans has been driven by an explosion in demand for meat as consumers switch from a diet dominated by rice to one where pork, poultry and beef play an important part. Chinese production of meat from those three animals surged 250 percent from 1986 to 2012 and is projected to increase another 30 percent by the end of the current decade. However, China is unable to produce enough animal feed itself, hence the need to import soybeans from the United States and Brazil.

That’s why the tariffs have tremendous potential to hurt farmers here in Ohio, where soybeans are the number one agricultural export at $1.4 billion. China is the state’s largest export market.

And Ohio is just the sixth-largest exporter of soybeans, after Illinois, Iowa, Minnesota, Indiana and Nebraska, all of which will suffer from the tariffs.

Not only do farmers stand to lose out by giving up market share to Brazilian farmers, but soybean prices will probably fall as well, hurting incomes and creating a double whammy for Midwest farms.

so those farmers my have to grow something else to sell in the US market. Its called adapting to change and dealing with reality. the government is not responsible to guaranty any market for US farmers.

so those farmers my have to grow something else to sell in the US market. Its called adapting to change and dealing with reality. the government is not responsible to guaranty any market for US farmers.

So then. Tell us some more about Obama's "war on coal" and why it was so awful.

not the same. He was trying to tax US coal companies out of business. Trump is trying to put US companies on an equal footing with their foreign competitors.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

And lesson for dummies red
Were China to want to match Trump’s latest threat, it wouldn’t have enough American goods imports to target. It could take other measures like curbing package tours or student transfers to the U.S., or hamper American companies operating in China.

“This is starting to feel like the beginnings of a trade war, if simply each proposal is matched with a retaliation,” said Patrick Bennett, a Hong Kong-based strategist at Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce. “The U.S. risks isolating itself from global trade in this process and we think the U.S., USD and U.S. asset markets have more to lose.”

we would win a trade war and china would lose. previous presidents have allowed china to win and help put this country in huge debt to china, Trump is trying to reverse that.

We don't need Chinese products to survive, but they need American food to survive. We have all the leverage here to stop the unfair advantage they have had for far too long.

how do you win a trade war, trump loon? and how do you think you're better able to gauge the effects of a trade war than actual smart people who are trained in economics.

hint: you can't.

OK, jelly. does china sell more to America or does America sell more to china? Hint: the country selling the most has the most to lose in a trade war.

Great. Losing anything is putting us worse off then before, fool. Rising prices will negate any gains made through tax cuts.

So to recap, Trump gave us deficit expanding tax cuts and then created artificial inflation that swallows up those gains. He's raised our national debt considerably for no gains.
Brilliant!

Do you understand that American jobs are impacted when a foreign country sells the same product for less than the US companies? Tariffs just put US companies on an equal footing with their foreign competitors. Do you think its fair that Germany puts a 100% tariff on Harley Davidson motorcycles sold in Germany? But we don't put tariffs on Mercedes or BMWs?

I think you, not unlike Trump, have no idea of how any of this works.

 

[Correll]

we would win a trade war and china would lose. previous presidents have allowed china to win and help put this country in huge debt to china, Trump is trying to reverse that.

We don't need Chinese products to survive, but they need American food to survive. We have all the leverage here to stop the unfair advantage they have had for far too long.

how do you win a trade war, trump loon? and how do you think you're better able to gauge the effects of a trade war than actual smart people who are trained in economics.

hint: you can't.

OK, jelly. does china sell more to America or does America sell more to china? Hint: the country selling the most has the most to lose in a trade war.

Great. Losing anything is putting us worse off then before, fool. Rising prices will negate any gains made through tax cuts.

So to recap, Trump gave us deficit expanding tax cuts and then created artificial inflation that swallows up those gains. He's raised our national debt considerably for no gains.
Brilliant!

Do you understand that American jobs are impacted when a foreign country sells the same product for less than the US companies? Tariffs just put US companies on an equal footing with their foreign competitors. Do you think its fair that Germany puts a 100% tariff on Harley Davidson motorcycles sold in Germany? But we don't put tariffs on Mercedes or BMWs?

I think you, not unlike Trump, have no idea of how any of this works.

You did not answer his very on topic question about tariffs on motorcycles.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

how do you win a trade war, trump loon? and how do you think you're better able to gauge the effects of a trade war than actual smart people who are trained in economics.

hint: you can't.

OK, jelly. does china sell more to America or does America sell more to china? Hint: the country selling the most has the most to lose in a trade war.

we all know america sells only about 154 billion to china and most of the meat planes etc are targeted at red states And imo the chinese citizen is far more adept at living in pain than even redstate crackers

those products will be sold to US markets. there is no pain involved, dingleberry.

They will be sold in US markets. At what pricepoint?

equal or less than the foreign products. so the consumer decides based on quality, not price.

More evidence that you have no idea.

Do you understand that American jobs are impacted when a foreign country sells the same product for less than the US companies? Tariffs just put US companies on an equal footing with their foreign competitors.

You just said that tariffs bring cheaper foreign goods up to the price of American goods.

That's a price increase. Inflation.

equal or less than the foreign products. so the consumer decides based on quality, not price.

By your logic, the price is the same.

 

[Nova78]

"What is the Democrats' message?"

Demorats have know message ,they are candle holding sheeples

 

[Hutch Starskey]

how do you win a trade war, trump loon? and how do you think you're better able to gauge the effects of a trade war than actual smart people who are trained in economics.

hint: you can't.

OK, jelly. does china sell more to America or does America sell more to china? Hint: the country selling the most has the most to lose in a trade war.

The education of redfish
Why China’s soybean tariffs matter
April 5, 2018 6.46am EDT
A farmer harvest his soybean field in Loami, Ill. AP Photo/Seth Perlman
Aut
China’s plan to levy a 25 percent tariff on imports of U.S. soybeans may come as something of a surprise to most Americans. But to a professor of agricultural economics who studies international commodity markets for a living, this was not at all unexpected.

Even before the conclusion of the 2016 presidential race, trade analysts were already weighing the possibility that China might impose an embargo on U.S. soybean imports based on protectionist rhetoric from both candidates.

And now that risk of a trade war is reality, and American soybean farmers may be among the biggest losers.

Soybeans are a crucial part of the global food chain, particularly as a source of protein in the production of hogs and poultry.

In 2016, the U.S. accounted for US$22.8 billion worth of global soybean exports, the most of any country. Its nearest competitor is Brazil, which exported $21 billion.


Meanwhile, China accounts for the lion’s share of global soybean imports at $34 billion, or two-thirds of the total.

American exports made up about a third of that, or $12.4 billion, making soybeans the United States’ second-most valuable export to China after varieties of airplanes.


The importance of China as a market for soybeans has been driven by an explosion in demand for meat as consumers switch from a diet dominated by rice to one where pork, poultry and beef play an important part. Chinese production of meat from those three animals surged 250 percent from 1986 to 2012 and is projected to increase another 30 percent by the end of the current decade. However, China is unable to produce enough animal feed itself, hence the need to import soybeans from the United States and Brazil.

That’s why the tariffs have tremendous potential to hurt farmers here in Ohio, where soybeans are the number one agricultural export at $1.4 billion. China is the state’s largest export market.

And Ohio is just the sixth-largest exporter of soybeans, after Illinois, Iowa, Minnesota, Indiana and Nebraska, all of which will suffer from the tariffs.

Not only do farmers stand to lose out by giving up market share to Brazilian farmers, but soybean prices will probably fall as well, hurting incomes and creating a double whammy for Midwest farms.

so those farmers my have to grow something else to sell in the US market. Its called adapting to change and dealing with reality. the government is not responsible to guaranty any market for US farmers.

so those farmers my have to grow something else to sell in the US market. Its called adapting to change and dealing with reality. the government is not responsible to guaranty any market for US farmers.

So then. Tell us some more about Obama's "war on coal" and why it was so awful.

not the same. He was trying to tax US coal companies out of business. Trump is trying to put US companies on an equal footing with their foreign competitors.

not the same. He was trying to tax US coal companies out of business. Trump is trying to put US companies on an equal footing with their foreign competitors.

Equal footing?

By pricing them out of the market?

So, it's not the same because Trump is too stupid to know he's doing it deliberately?
Got it?

 

[Redfish]

we would win a trade war and china would lose. previous presidents have allowed china to win and help put this country in huge debt to china, Trump is trying to reverse that.

We don't need Chinese products to survive, but they need American food to survive. We have all the leverage here to stop the unfair advantage they have had for far too long.

how do you win a trade war, trump loon? and how do you think you're better able to gauge the effects of a trade war than actual smart people who are trained in economics.

hint: you can't.

OK, jelly. does china sell more to America or does America sell more to china? Hint: the country selling the most has the most to lose in a trade war.

Great. Losing anything is putting us worse off then before, fool. Rising prices will negate any gains made through tax cuts.

So to recap, Trump gave us deficit expanding tax cuts and then created artificial inflation that swallows up those gains. He's raised our national debt considerably for no gains.
Brilliant!

Do you understand that American jobs are impacted when a foreign country sells the same product for less than the US companies? Tariffs just put US companies on an equal footing with their foreign competitors. Do you think its fair that Germany puts a 100% tariff on Harley Davidson motorcycles sold in Germany? But we don't put tariffs on Mercedes or BMWs?

I think you, not unlike Trump, have no idea of how any of this works.

I know exactly how it works, I dealt in that world for over 40 years. You are a victim of the lying media and the dem spin machine.

 

[Redfish]

OK, jelly. does china sell more to America or does America sell more to china? Hint: the country selling the most has the most to lose in a trade war.

we all know america sells only about 154 billion to china and most of the meat planes etc are targeted at red states And imo the chinese citizen is far more adept at living in pain than even redstate crackers

those products will be sold to US markets. there is no pain involved, dingleberry.

They will be sold in US markets. At what pricepoint?

equal or less than the foreign products. so the consumer decides based on quality, not price.

More evidence that you have no idea.

Do you understand that American jobs are impacted when a foreign country sells the same product for less than the US companies? Tariffs just put US companies on an equal footing with their foreign competitors.

You just said that tariffs bring cheaper foreign goods up to the price of American goods.

That's a price increase. Inflation.

equal or less than the foreign products. so the consumer decides based on quality, not price.

By your logic, the price is the same.

yes, the prices would be very close. that's the point.

and yes, it may mean that americans have to pay a little more and cannot buy cheap Chinese knockoffs any more.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

how do you win a trade war, trump loon? and how do you think you're better able to gauge the effects of a trade war than actual smart people who are trained in economics.

hint: you can't.

OK, jelly. does china sell more to America or does America sell more to china? Hint: the country selling the most has the most to lose in a trade war.

Great. Losing anything is putting us worse off then before, fool. Rising prices will negate any gains made through tax cuts.

So to recap, Trump gave us deficit expanding tax cuts and then created artificial inflation that swallows up those gains. He's raised our national debt considerably for no gains.
Brilliant!

Do you understand that American jobs are impacted when a foreign country sells the same product for less than the US companies? Tariffs just put US companies on an equal footing with their foreign competitors. Do you think its fair that Germany puts a 100% tariff on Harley Davidson motorcycles sold in Germany? But we don't put tariffs on Mercedes or BMWs?

I think you, not unlike Trump, have no idea of how any of this works.

You did not answer his very on topic question about tariffs on motorcycles.

It's irrelevant without understanding the rationale behind that deal.