Why is Building the Wall Wrong?

[Issa]

It makes wonder also how some of those border agents make more than their salaries, and dozens got arrested.

Really? When?

Dude I keep telling you the primary problem with you guys, anti immigrants, pro trump I'd being ignorant of facts and you live ina bunnle....we lose our shit trying to explain to you but your fear and ignorance is blinding uou.
Here read the article, and don't tell me is fake news.

U.S. Border Agency Says Hundreds of Employees Have Been Arrested Over 2 Years

I couldn't get to the site because they want money which I'm not about the pay. So I did a Google search to find a credible news source reporting on the story as well, and can't find one. I did find a story from some internet site called Pogo.com, however I never heard of them before and it's likely they just parroted the NYT story.

But in that story their claim is that 200 agents (80 of them border patrol) were arrested since 2004. No elaboration on how many were charged or actually convicted and for what offense.

Wow just wow....so you only beleive fox news and trump?
I live in California and things like these are known, CBP officers get caught all the time.
Widen your sources and open your mind.

Well according to what I read, it's about 200 in 14 years. That boils down to about 14 per year, so I wouldn't say all the time. And again, I couldn't find anything on conviction rate either.

In other words, we probably have more bad cops in the country than that. So because we do, is that any reason to not have a police force in this country?

Those are the ones that got caught, now imagine how many are taking bribes and are letting the drugs flow.
Most of those who want the wall, they dont live with illegals or dealt with them they generally are afraid the unknown, they also dont live or lived with muslims so they feared them too. That's why mostly those in mostly white Republicans areas are racists and bigots.

 

[Markle]

OMG. You force those who agree with you that problem exists to play the devil's advocate and not let you get away with that LIE.

The ONLY tax that so - called illegals can be accused of not paying is the federal income tax. That is graduated tax - a plank from the Communist Manifesto. You should help repeal that Amendment IF that is your beef.

But, wait... the CHIEF ACTUARY OF THE SSA says 75 percent of those without papers DO pay that tax. EVERYBODY who works under the table, denying to the commies that tribute are doing all of us a public service.

My highlight above.

Liar.

About 6.1 Million Illegals Filed Taxes in US – Many Didn't Pay, Received Refunds


By James Agresti | November 7, 2016 | 2:57 PM EST
[...]
Nonetheless, the contrast between tax returns filed with and without ITINs in 2010 is enlightening. As documented above, 72 percent of ITIN filers paid no income tax and received cash payments through child tax credits. In comparison, only 14 percent of people who filed regular tax returns (with a Social Security number instead of an ITIN) paid no income tax and received these payments.
[...]
About 6.1 Million Illegals Filed Taxes in US – Many Didn't Pay, Received Refunds

 

[oreo]

According to Trump--we're no longer talking about a WALL it's down to steel slats. Of course this is G.W. Bush's design that he installed on 700 miles of the border---

Trump now describes his border wall as "steel slats" - WDEF

Very easily compromised as this video shows.


And let's not forget about those tunnels

They have found 240 of these in the San Diego region alone, and they know there's more that they haven't found.

So House Republicans put on their last Hoorah yesterday by passing a bill that included 5.1 billion for the WAAAAALLL. Of course this is dead on arrival in the Senate. Republicans had a full house over the last 2 years, and all of a sudden up pops this bill as they're making their exit out of the back door. 5.7 BILLION is the equivalent of teaspoon of water thrown on a bonfire, as the wall would cost 47 BILLION dollars.

So up comes the steel slats. Democrats have stated they want more border security but want to use HIGH TECH to secure the border, stating that border patrol and border experts have told them it would work better than walls & fences. It would be much more effective and efficient for the above reasons. It's true. Anything they can see, can and will ALWAYS be compromised, something they can't see won't even be attempted.

So we will see who is more interested in border security. I imagine the Ass Clown--will turn down the HIGH TECH option and go with his POS wall (I mean slats now) and shut down the government over it.

Don't ever let any FACTS come up and bite you in the Ass--

This past week, Republican Rep. Will Hurd from Texas, a former CIA agent, slammed the "fallacy that a wall equals border security." He explained, "I have more border (in my district) than any other member of Congress, 820 miles," and added that we can use available technology to keep us far safer than a wall. Hurd closed with a key point: "Building a wall from sea to shining sea is the most expensive and least effective way to do border security."
But Trump refuses to accept that technology suggested by people like Hurd and others will address the problem. Instead, Trump on Sunday took to Twitter to mock that very concept, writing, "Drones and all of the rest are wonderful and lots of fun," he wrote, but the "only way to stop drug, gangs, human trafficking, criminal elements" is by building a "good old fashioned Wall" -- or, perhaps, a "Steel Slat Barrier."

For me, the choice is clear -- not only given Trump's track record, but because statistics also undermine his claims. First, despite what Trump wants you to believe, studies make it clear that immigrants, both undocumented and those legally here, are "considerably less likely to commit crime than native-born citizens." One study, conducted by the Cato Institute, found that "as a percentage of their respective populations, there were 56% fewer criminal convictions of illegal immigrants than of native-born Americans in Texas in 2015." On top of that, illegal border crossings are currently at their lowest levels since 2000. And nearly two thirds of those now in the country illegally are here because they overstayed their visas after arriving via airports, while others even came over the northern border from Canada. A massive southern border wall obviously won't address this.

Why Trump can't let go of his border wall dream (Opinion) - CNN

We have a very long, expensive history of walls & fences not working along the southern border. Democrats are following the advice of border security experts & agents who want to use high tech to secure the border. Something that can be seen (can)--and will always be compromised, something that can't be seen won't even be attempted.



I really don't think the half brained Trump tards are interested in border security as much as they are in trying to save Trump. Their right wing talk show hosts are telling them if Trump doesn't get the Trump WALL, it will be the end of his presidency. In reality, meaning the end of THEM because they shoved Trump down their throats over the wall.
November 28, 2018 - TRUMP'S GREAT WALL BECOMES TRUMP'S GREAT STALL

 

[Wyatt earp]

Really? When?

Dude I keep telling you the primary problem with you guys, anti immigrants, pro trump I'd being ignorant of facts and you live ina bunnle....we lose our shit trying to explain to you but your fear and ignorance is blinding uou.
Here read the article, and don't tell me is fake news.

U.S. Border Agency Says Hundreds of Employees Have Been Arrested Over 2 Years

I couldn't get to the site because they want money which I'm not about the pay. So I did a Google search to find a credible news source reporting on the story as well, and can't find one. I did find a story from some internet site called Pogo.com, however I never heard of them before and it's likely they just parroted the NYT story.

But in that story their claim is that 200 agents (80 of them border patrol) were arrested since 2004. No elaboration on how many were charged or actually convicted and for what offense.

Wow just wow....so you only beleive fox news and trump?
I live in California and things like these are known, CBP officers get caught all the time.
Widen your sources and open your mind.

Well according to what I read, it's about 200 in 14 years. That boils down to about 14 per year, so I wouldn't say all the time. And again, I couldn't find anything on conviction rate either.

In other words, we probably have more bad cops in the country than that. So because we do, is that any reason to not have a police force in this country?

Those are the ones that got caught, now imagine how many are taking bribes and are letting the drugs flow.
Most of those who want the wall, they dont live with illegals or dealt with them they generally are afraid the unknown, they also dont live or lived with muslims so they feared them too. That's why mostly those in mostly white Republicans areas are racists and bigots.

No, you can't jeopardize the rest of the country safety with your anarchy



.

 

[Wyatt earp]

According to Trump--we're no longer talking about a WALL it's down to steel slats. Of course this is G.W. Bush's design that he installed on 700 miles of the border---

Trump now describes his border wall as "steel slats" - WDEF

Very easily compromised as this video shows.


And let's not forget about those tunnels

They have found 240 of these in the San Diego region alone, and they know there's more that they haven't found.

So House Republicans put on their last Hoorah yesterday by passing a bill that included 5.1 billion for the WAAAAALLL. Of course this is dead on arrival in the Senate. Republicans had a full house over the last 2 years, and all of a sudden up pops this bill as they're making their exit out of the back door. 5.7 BILLION is the equivalent of teaspoon of water thrown on a bonfire, as the wall would cost 47 BILLION dollars.

So up comes the steel slats. Democrats have stated they want more border security but want to use HIGH TECH to secure the border, stating that border patrol and border experts have told them it would work better than walls & fences. It would be much more effective and efficient for the above reasons. It's true. Anything they can see, can and will ALWAYS be compromised, something they can't see won't even be attempted.

So we will see who is more interested in border security. I imagine the Ass Clown--will turn down the HIGH TECH option and go with his POS wall (I mean slats now) and shut down the government over it.

Don't ever let any FACTS come up and bite you in the Ass--

This past week, Republican Rep. Will Hurd from Texas, a former CIA agent, slammed the "fallacy that a wall equals border security." He explained, "I have more border (in my district) than any other member of Congress, 820 miles," and added that we can use available technology to keep us far safer than a wall. Hurd closed with a key point: "Building a wall from sea to shining sea is the most expensive and least effective way to do border security."
But Trump refuses to accept that technology suggested by people like Hurd and others will address the problem. Instead, Trump on Sunday took to Twitter to mock that very concept, writing, "Drones and all of the rest are wonderful and lots of fun," he wrote, but the "only way to stop drug, gangs, human trafficking, criminal elements" is by building a "good old fashioned Wall" -- or, perhaps, a "Steel Slat Barrier."

For me, the choice is clear -- not only given Trump's track record, but because statistics also undermine his claims. First, despite what Trump wants you to believe, studies make it clear that immigrants, both undocumented and those legally here, are "considerably less likely to commit crime than native-born citizens." One study, conducted by the Cato Institute, found that "as a percentage of their respective populations, there were 56% fewer criminal convictions of illegal immigrants than of native-born Americans in Texas in 2015." On top of that, illegal border crossings are currently at their lowest levels since 2000. And nearly two thirds of those now in the country illegally are here because they overstayed their visas after arriving via airports, while others even came over the northern border from Canada. A massive southern border wall obviously won't address this.

Why Trump can't let go of his border wall dream (Opinion) - CNN

We have a very long, expensive history of walls & fences not working along the southern border. Democrats are following the advice of border security experts & agents who want to use high tech to secure the border. Something that can be seen (can)--and will always be compromised, something that can't be seen won't even be attempted.



I really don't think the half brained Trump tards are interested in border security as much as they are in trying to save Trump. Their right wing talk show hosts are telling them if Trump doesn't get the Trump WALL, it will be the end of his presidency. In reality, meaning the end of THEM because they shoved Trump down their throats over the wall.
November 28, 2018 - TRUMP'S GREAT WALL BECOMES TRUMP'S GREAT STALL

Climb this wall

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

What's that gibberish?


I bet you go to a plumber to get an enema , instead of going to a doctor right?

.

Your personal attacks are indicative of the FEAR you have that your arguments aren't working. I accept your concession of defeat.

You attacked me first , now answer my questions propaganda boi..



Tell us are fences and walls on people's property , in effective and should be outlawed In your free society?

There are fences in my neighborhood. A "crew" recently went through the place and got six of my neighbors, stealing all their valuables. My fence is down. I did not get hit. My methods provided a greater deterrent with less imposition and not having this mistaken notion than walls or fences prevented those guys from attempting to take what I own.

You have an asinine analogy that does not apply anyway. The wall will require ninja clad, machine gun toting mercenaries wanting more and more power, taking ALL your Liberties under the pretext of maintaining this wall. You seem to be one talking skeet and promoting propaganda. And, no sir, I have NOT started any name calling with you or anyone else. I might attack your ideas and poke fun at the low IQ people you hang with, but like it or not, you may have to rely on me to defend your Rights one day - IF you have a change of heart and decide that you NEVER give up essential Liberty for the promise of Temporary Safety.

What liberties am I giving up if the wall is built?

I've answered that twice in this thread. READ IT. This repetitive stuff is for people that are too stupid to read OR cannot understand that the excuses for the wall have been refuted hundreds of times on this thread.

The excuses for not having a wall has been debunked a hundred times on this thread and the dozen or so just like it.

It won't work. How do you know until it's built?

It will take away our freedoms. How? Name me one freedom I would lose by a wall a thousand miles away from me.

It will be too authoritative and promote dictatorship. HTF can a wall change a country and politics?

It's racist. Why, because the people who are constantly sneaking into our country have different color skin, and it it were white people, we would be okay with invaders?

It won't stop drugs. Most of the heroin coming into the US is from Mexico.

They will dig tunnels. They dig tunnels now! Do you know how many months it takes to dig tunnels?

 

[oreo]

According to Trump--we're no longer talking about a WALL it's down to steel slats. Of course this is G.W. Bush's design that he installed on 700 miles of the border---

Trump now describes his border wall as "steel slats" - WDEF

Very easily compromised as this video shows.


And let's not forget about those tunnels

They have found 240 of these in the San Diego region alone, and they know there's more that they haven't found.

So House Republicans put on their last Hoorah yesterday by passing a bill that included 5.1 billion for the WAAAAALLL. Of course this is dead on arrival in the Senate. Republicans had a full house over the last 2 years, and all of a sudden up pops this bill as they're making their exit out of the back door. 5.7 BILLION is the equivalent of teaspoon of water thrown on a bonfire, as the wall would cost 47 BILLION dollars.

So up comes the steel slats. Democrats have stated they want more border security but want to use HIGH TECH to secure the border, stating that border patrol and border experts have told them it would work better than walls & fences. It would be much more effective and efficient for the above reasons. It's true. Anything they can see, can and will ALWAYS be compromised, something they can't see won't even be attempted.

So we will see who is more interested in border security. I imagine the Ass Clown--will turn down the HIGH TECH option and go with his POS wall (I mean slats now) and shut down the government over it.

Don't ever let any FACTS come up and bite you in the Ass--

This past week, Republican Rep. Will Hurd from Texas, a former CIA agent, slammed the "fallacy that a wall equals border security." He explained, "I have more border (in my district) than any other member of Congress, 820 miles," and added that we can use available technology to keep us far safer than a wall. Hurd closed with a key point: "Building a wall from sea to shining sea is the most expensive and least effective way to do border security."
But Trump refuses to accept that technology suggested by people like Hurd and others will address the problem. Instead, Trump on Sunday took to Twitter to mock that very concept, writing, "Drones and all of the rest are wonderful and lots of fun," he wrote, but the "only way to stop drug, gangs, human trafficking, criminal elements" is by building a "good old fashioned Wall" -- or, perhaps, a "Steel Slat Barrier."

For me, the choice is clear -- not only given Trump's track record, but because statistics also undermine his claims. First, despite what Trump wants you to believe, studies make it clear that immigrants, both undocumented and those legally here, are "considerably less likely to commit crime than native-born citizens." One study, conducted by the Cato Institute, found that "as a percentage of their respective populations, there were 56% fewer criminal convictions of illegal immigrants than of native-born Americans in Texas in 2015." On top of that, illegal border crossings are currently at their lowest levels since 2000. And nearly two thirds of those now in the country illegally are here because they overstayed their visas after arriving via airports, while others even came over the northern border from Canada. A massive southern border wall obviously won't address this.

Why Trump can't let go of his border wall dream (Opinion) - CNN

We have a very long, expensive history of walls & fences not working along the southern border. Democrats are following the advice of border security experts & agents who want to use high tech to secure the border. Something that can be seen (can)--and will always be compromised, something that can't be seen won't even be attempted.



I really don't think the half brained Trump tards are interested in border security as much as they are in trying to save Trump. Their right wing talk show hosts are telling them if Trump doesn't get the Trump WALL, it will be the end of his presidency. In reality, meaning the end of THEM because they shoved Trump down their throats over the wall.
November 28, 2018 - TRUMP'S GREAT WALL BECOMES TRUMP'S GREAT STALL

Climb this wall



View attachment 236503

Do you really believe that wall couldn't be compromised?

Your personal attacks are indicative of the FEAR you have that your arguments aren't working. I accept your concession of defeat.

You attacked me first , now answer my questions propaganda boi..



Tell us are fences and walls on people's property , in effective and should be outlawed In your free society?

There are fences in my neighborhood. A "crew" recently went through the place and got six of my neighbors, stealing all their valuables. My fence is down. I did not get hit. My methods provided a greater deterrent with less imposition and not having this mistaken notion than walls or fences prevented those guys from attempting to take what I own.

You have an asinine analogy that does not apply anyway. The wall will require ninja clad, machine gun toting mercenaries wanting more and more power, taking ALL your Liberties under the pretext of maintaining this wall. You seem to be one talking skeet and promoting propaganda. And, no sir, I have NOT started any name calling with you or anyone else. I might attack your ideas and poke fun at the low IQ people you hang with, but like it or not, you may have to rely on me to defend your Rights one day - IF you have a change of heart and decide that you NEVER give up essential Liberty for the promise of Temporary Safety.

What liberties am I giving up if the wall is built?

I've answered that twice in this thread. READ IT. This repetitive stuff is for people that are too stupid to read OR cannot understand that the excuses for the wall have been refuted hundreds of times on this thread.

The excuses for not having a wall has been debunked a hundred times on this thread and the dozen or so just like it.

It won't work. How do you know until it's built?

It will take away our freedoms. How? Name me one freedom I would lose by a wall a thousand miles away from me.

It will be too authoritative and promote dictatorship. HTF can a wall change a country and politics?

It's racist. Why, because the people who are constantly sneaking into our country have different color skin, and it it were white people, we would be okay with invaders?

It won't stop drugs. Most of the heroin coming into the US is from Mexico.

They will dig tunnels. They dig tunnels now! Do you know how many months it takes to dig tunnels?

You're not interested at all in actual border security, you're just trying to save Trump's legacy.

Redirect to a comment from a Republican House member whose district in Texas is 800 miles of the border. Click here to redirect to the post on this thread
Why is Building the Wall Wrong?

 

[Wyatt earp]

According to Trump--we're no longer talking about a WALL it's down to steel slats. Of course this is G.W. Bush's design that he installed on 700 miles of the border---

Trump now describes his border wall as "steel slats" - WDEF

Very easily compromised as this video shows.


And let's not forget about those tunnels

They have found 240 of these in the San Diego region alone, and they know there's more that they haven't found.

So House Republicans put on their last Hoorah yesterday by passing a bill that included 5.1 billion for the WAAAAALLL. Of course this is dead on arrival in the Senate. Republicans had a full house over the last 2 years, and all of a sudden up pops this bill as they're making their exit out of the back door. 5.7 BILLION is the equivalent of teaspoon of water thrown on a bonfire, as the wall would cost 47 BILLION dollars.

So up comes the steel slats. Democrats have stated they want more border security but want to use HIGH TECH to secure the border, stating that border patrol and border experts have told them it would work better than walls & fences. It would be much more effective and efficient for the above reasons. It's true. Anything they can see, can and will ALWAYS be compromised, something they can't see won't even be attempted.

So we will see who is more interested in border security. I imagine the Ass Clown--will turn down the HIGH TECH option and go with his POS wall (I mean slats now) and shut down the government over it.

Don't ever let any FACTS come up and bite you in the Ass--

This past week, Republican Rep. Will Hurd from Texas, a former CIA agent, slammed the "fallacy that a wall equals border security." He explained, "I have more border (in my district) than any other member of Congress, 820 miles," and added that we can use available technology to keep us far safer than a wall. Hurd closed with a key point: "Building a wall from sea to shining sea is the most expensive and least effective way to do border security."
But Trump refuses to accept that technology suggested by people like Hurd and others will address the problem. Instead, Trump on Sunday took to Twitter to mock that very concept, writing, "Drones and all of the rest are wonderful and lots of fun," he wrote, but the "only way to stop drug, gangs, human trafficking, criminal elements" is by building a "good old fashioned Wall" -- or, perhaps, a "Steel Slat Barrier."

For me, the choice is clear -- not only given Trump's track record, but because statistics also undermine his claims. First, despite what Trump wants you to believe, studies make it clear that immigrants, both undocumented and those legally here, are "considerably less likely to commit crime than native-born citizens." One study, conducted by the Cato Institute, found that "as a percentage of their respective populations, there were 56% fewer criminal convictions of illegal immigrants than of native-born Americans in Texas in 2015." On top of that, illegal border crossings are currently at their lowest levels since 2000. And nearly two thirds of those now in the country illegally are here because they overstayed their visas after arriving via airports, while others even came over the northern border from Canada. A massive southern border wall obviously won't address this.

Why Trump can't let go of his border wall dream (Opinion) - CNN

We have a very long, expensive history of walls & fences not working along the southern border. Democrats are following the advice of border security experts & agents who want to use high tech to secure the border. Something that can be seen (can)--and will always be compromised, something that can't be seen won't even be attempted.



I really don't think the half brained Trump tards are interested in border security as much as they are in trying to save Trump. Their right wing talk show hosts are telling them if Trump doesn't get the Trump WALL, it will be the end of his presidency. In reality, meaning the end of THEM because they shoved Trump down their throats over the wall.
November 28, 2018 - TRUMP'S GREAT WALL BECOMES TRUMP'S GREAT STALL

Climb this wall



View attachment 236503

Do you really believe that wall couldn't be compromised?

You attacked me first , now answer my questions propaganda boi..



Tell us are fences and walls on people's property , in effective and should be outlawed In your free society?

There are fences in my neighborhood. A "crew" recently went through the place and got six of my neighbors, stealing all their valuables. My fence is down. I did not get hit. My methods provided a greater deterrent with less imposition and not having this mistaken notion than walls or fences prevented those guys from attempting to take what I own.

You have an asinine analogy that does not apply anyway. The wall will require ninja clad, machine gun toting mercenaries wanting more and more power, taking ALL your Liberties under the pretext of maintaining this wall. You seem to be one talking skeet and promoting propaganda. And, no sir, I have NOT started any name calling with you or anyone else. I might attack your ideas and poke fun at the low IQ people you hang with, but like it or not, you may have to rely on me to defend your Rights one day - IF you have a change of heart and decide that you NEVER give up essential Liberty for the promise of Temporary Safety.

What liberties am I giving up if the wall is built?

I've answered that twice in this thread. READ IT. This repetitive stuff is for people that are too stupid to read OR cannot understand that the excuses for the wall have been refuted hundreds of times on this thread.

The excuses for not having a wall has been debunked a hundred times on this thread and the dozen or so just like it.

It won't work. How do you know until it's built?

It will take away our freedoms. How? Name me one freedom I would lose by a wall a thousand miles away from me.

It will be too authoritative and promote dictatorship. HTF can a wall change a country and politics?

It's racist. Why, because the people who are constantly sneaking into our country have different color skin, and it it were white people, we would be okay with invaders?

It won't stop drugs. Most of the heroin coming into the US is from Mexico.

They will dig tunnels. They dig tunnels now! Do you know how many months it takes to dig tunnels?

You're not interested at all in actual border security, you're just trying to save Trump's legacy.

Redirect to a comment from a Republican House member whose district in Texas is 800 miles of the border. Click here to redirect to the post on this thread
Why is Building the Wall Wrong?

It's a deterrent to fat ass Mexicans


.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Then why do you keep bringing him up?

You sound like a parakeet, always rehashing what Hush Bimbo said.

Criminals like easy access to their targets. They want to get in and then get out quickly. Do gated communities work most times? Yes. All the time? Perhaps not. It really depends on the area.

Will a wall stop all illegals? No it won't. Will it reduce illegals and drugs to a more tolerable level, yes it will.

While you relish in ancient history, we in modern times know walls and borders do work.

Homeland Security secretary: Border walls work. Yuma sector proves it.

Where do Border Fences work? Everywhere

https://nypost.com/2018/01/13/we-already-have-a-border-wall-and-it-works/

Hungary credits razor wire border fence for almost 100 percent drop in illegal migration

What your sources are not revealing is that they took OTHER precautions - which you conveniently ignore.

What's that gibberish?


I bet you go to a plumber to get an enema , instead of going to a doctor right?

.

Your personal attacks are indicative of the FEAR you have that your arguments aren't working. I accept your concession of defeat.

You attacked me first , now answer my questions propaganda boi..



Tell us are fences and walls on people's property , in effective and should be outlawed In your free society?

There are fences in my neighborhood. A "crew" recently went through the place and got six of my neighbors, stealing all their valuables. My fence is down. I did not get hit. My methods provided a greater deterrent with less imposition and not having this mistaken notion than walls or fences prevented those guys from attempting to take what I own.

You have an asinine analogy that does not apply anyway. The wall will require ninja clad, machine gun toting mercenaries wanting more and more power, taking ALL your Liberties under the pretext of maintaining this wall. You seem to be one talking skeet and promoting propaganda. And, no sir, I have NOT started any name calling with you or anyone else. I might attack your ideas and poke fun at the low IQ people you hang with, but like it or not, you may have to rely on me to defend your Rights one day - IF you have a change of heart and decide that you NEVER give up essential Liberty for the promise of Temporary Safety.

Government providing safety does not take away liberty. I don't know how you can't see it can be one without the other.

Will a wall take away freedoms? Yes it will; freedoms illegals have coming over now. It won't take any freedom away from Americans because the wall is not to keep us from leaving, it's to keep them from entering our country.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Even if they are "rehabilitated," they are still going to take a job that would otherwise go to a native born American. The are also going to create downward pressure on wages since they are will to work for a much lower wage than most Americans.

Employers have no "unalienable right" to hire people who are not in this country legally.

Ones pics say it all.
But I'll try to be patient.
Italians, Germans, Asians and now Latinos all cost the first year.
All subsequent years they contribute way more than our old white farts here sucking off their socialist benefits

Wrong, asshole. We didn't have welfare, public schools, and government healthcare when the Italians and Germans came here.

we didn't have a Great Depression, either or world wars.

What's your point?

Danielpalos never intends to have a point, he's merely an angry troll.

Which is why he's on my ignore list and should be on everybody's.

 

[beautress]

You said, "Italians, Germans, Asians and now Latinos all cost the first year. All subsequent years they contribute way more than our old white farts here sucking off their socialist benefits"

You obviously are unaware that social security was paid for with taking out 7.5% of wages with employer requirements matching to the government for a lifetime of work--12 times a year or 52 times a year depending on whether we received monthly or weekly wages. The cruel part is that we were promised interest payments would be returned into Social Security right up until the time politicians got greedy and decided to "borrow" the interest and sometimes the principals for their pet rock projects. Call us what you will, but we paid for our retirement benefits way ahead of time and with no choice and no say in the investments which were expropriated by very evil people who used it to get higher salaries for themselves and the people who pleasured them. One thing about taxes and promises. What it buys is not only never good enough, it also is not what was intended when we agreed to pay it. I paid my fair share always, regardless of what foul name you care to call other people than yourself who receive the benefits every one of us has to pay from our earnings..

Your post is 100% WRONG.

At the turn of the century, immigrants cost us nothing.

Employees now pay 15.3%. The smoke and mirrors want you to believe your employer pays. Nonsense, otherwise that money would go to you.

We were never promised a return of the money we paid into Social Security plus interest. That's just foolish.

There has never been a separate, Social Security Trust Account. Any and all money paid into Social Security by workers has been used to pay current recipients. Any surplus is invested in Treasury Bills which puts the money into the General Fund and is spent.

Next time you post, please do some basic research. Your rant just looks foolish.

Common knowledge of business practices before you were born never came to your attention, did they, grade school?

Your problem is your severe failure to keep either current events you don't like on the back burner or you just never bothered to learn what was going on. Thanks to my dear parents, I have been reading (and remembering) news stories since I was six years old, the first of which was an unusually good picture of Ike Eisenhower winning his first term presidency. And you either have a reading comprehension problem, or you were unaware that following the Great Depression of the 1930s, Social Security came with the understanding those paying into it would have a retirement income and that any interest earned on the money Americans paid into the system would be funneled back into the system for the benefit of the security of the people who paid into it.

Go stand in the corner, kiddo. And listen well to the tone.

​

 

[oreo]

According to Trump--we're no longer talking about a WALL it's down to steel slats. Of course this is G.W. Bush's design that he installed on 700 miles of the border---

Trump now describes his border wall as "steel slats" - WDEF

Very easily compromised as this video shows.


And let's not forget about those tunnels

They have found 240 of these in the San Diego region alone, and they know there's more that they haven't found.

So House Republicans put on their last Hoorah yesterday by passing a bill that included 5.1 billion for the WAAAAALLL. Of course this is dead on arrival in the Senate. Republicans had a full house over the last 2 years, and all of a sudden up pops this bill as they're making their exit out of the back door. 5.7 BILLION is the equivalent of teaspoon of water thrown on a bonfire, as the wall would cost 47 BILLION dollars.

So up comes the steel slats. Democrats have stated they want more border security but want to use HIGH TECH to secure the border, stating that border patrol and border experts have told them it would work better than walls & fences. It would be much more effective and efficient for the above reasons. It's true. Anything they can see, can and will ALWAYS be compromised, something they can't see won't even be attempted.

So we will see who is more interested in border security. I imagine the Ass Clown--will turn down the HIGH TECH option and go with his POS wall (I mean slats now) and shut down the government over it.

Don't ever let any FACTS come up and bite you in the Ass--

This past week, Republican Rep. Will Hurd from Texas, a former CIA agent, slammed the "fallacy that a wall equals border security." He explained, "I have more border (in my district) than any other member of Congress, 820 miles," and added that we can use available technology to keep us far safer than a wall. Hurd closed with a key point: "Building a wall from sea to shining sea is the most expensive and least effective way to do border security."
But Trump refuses to accept that technology suggested by people like Hurd and others will address the problem. Instead, Trump on Sunday took to Twitter to mock that very concept, writing, "Drones and all of the rest are wonderful and lots of fun," he wrote, but the "only way to stop drug, gangs, human trafficking, criminal elements" is by building a "good old fashioned Wall" -- or, perhaps, a "Steel Slat Barrier."

For me, the choice is clear -- not only given Trump's track record, but because statistics also undermine his claims. First, despite what Trump wants you to believe, studies make it clear that immigrants, both undocumented and those legally here, are "considerably less likely to commit crime than native-born citizens." One study, conducted by the Cato Institute, found that "as a percentage of their respective populations, there were 56% fewer criminal convictions of illegal immigrants than of native-born Americans in Texas in 2015." On top of that, illegal border crossings are currently at their lowest levels since 2000. And nearly two thirds of those now in the country illegally are here because they overstayed their visas after arriving via airports, while others even came over the northern border from Canada. A massive southern border wall obviously won't address this.

Why Trump can't let go of his border wall dream (Opinion) - CNN

We have a very long, expensive history of walls & fences not working along the southern border. Democrats are following the advice of border security experts & agents who want to use high tech to secure the border. Something that can be seen (can)--and will always be compromised, something that can't be seen won't even be attempted.



I really don't think the half brained Trump tards are interested in border security as much as they are in trying to save Trump. Their right wing talk show hosts are telling them if Trump doesn't get the Trump WALL, it will be the end of his presidency. In reality, meaning the end of THEM because they shoved Trump down their throats over the wall.
November 28, 2018 - TRUMP'S GREAT WALL BECOMES TRUMP'S GREAT STALL

Climb this wall



View attachment 236503

Do you really believe that wall couldn't be compromised?

There are fences in my neighborhood. A "crew" recently went through the place and got six of my neighbors, stealing all their valuables. My fence is down. I did not get hit. My methods provided a greater deterrent with less imposition and not having this mistaken notion than walls or fences prevented those guys from attempting to take what I own.

You have an asinine analogy that does not apply anyway. The wall will require ninja clad, machine gun toting mercenaries wanting more and more power, taking ALL your Liberties under the pretext of maintaining this wall. You seem to be one talking skeet and promoting propaganda. And, no sir, I have NOT started any name calling with you or anyone else. I might attack your ideas and poke fun at the low IQ people you hang with, but like it or not, you may have to rely on me to defend your Rights one day - IF you have a change of heart and decide that you NEVER give up essential Liberty for the promise of Temporary Safety.

What liberties am I giving up if the wall is built?

I've answered that twice in this thread. READ IT. This repetitive stuff is for people that are too stupid to read OR cannot understand that the excuses for the wall have been refuted hundreds of times on this thread.

The excuses for not having a wall has been debunked a hundred times on this thread and the dozen or so just like it.

It won't work. How do you know until it's built?

It will take away our freedoms. How? Name me one freedom I would lose by a wall a thousand miles away from me.

It will be too authoritative and promote dictatorship. HTF can a wall change a country and politics?

It's racist. Why, because the people who are constantly sneaking into our country have different color skin, and it it were white people, we would be okay with invaders?

It won't stop drugs. Most of the heroin coming into the US is from Mexico.

They will dig tunnels. They dig tunnels now! Do you know how many months it takes to dig tunnels?

You're not interested at all in actual border security, you're just trying to save Trump's legacy.

Redirect to a comment from a Republican House member whose district in Texas is 800 miles of the border. Click here to redirect to the post on this thread
Why is Building the Wall Wrong?

It's a deterrent to fat ass Mexicans


.

I don't think there's too many fat Mexican's walking across deserts to climb walls and fences.

Yep no fat people.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

A- Cost prohibitive
B- Won't work
C- It's racist
D- It would reduce those successfully crossing the border
E- None of the Above

The machine benefits by not having a wall. Business (Republicans) get their cheap labor and (Democrats) get the votes

You scratch my back, I'll scratch yours

There is no excuse for the Republicans not funding the wall.

-Geaux

What is wrong with building the wall? I voted for Trump. Trump is wrong, like the liberals. We need to tear down the border wall. What we really need make a national identity card. Linked to fingerprints. You don't get a job if you can't prove your identity linked to your real immigration status . Why Replicratrats are so opposed to that, boggles my mind.

Well, let me help you unboggle your mind. Why not start by reading Orwell's book 1984. It was a warning in the form of a novel.

The government big enough to give you all you want is big enough to take all you have... a quote by a famous Republican

Nobody on the right is asking the government to "give" us anything. We are asking the government to stop something that we citizens cannot stop by ourselves. Big difference.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Don't ever let any FACTS come up and bite you in the Ass--

This past week, Republican Rep. Will Hurd from Texas, a former CIA agent, slammed the "fallacy that a wall equals border security." He explained, "I have more border (in my district) than any other member of Congress, 820 miles," and added that we can use available technology to keep us far safer than a wall. Hurd closed with a key point: "Building a wall from sea to shining sea is the most expensive and least effective way to do border security."
But Trump refuses to accept that technology suggested by people like Hurd and others will address the problem. Instead, Trump on Sunday took to Twitter to mock that very concept, writing, "Drones and all of the rest are wonderful and lots of fun," he wrote, but the "only way to stop drug, gangs, human trafficking, criminal elements" is by building a "good old fashioned Wall" -- or, perhaps, a "Steel Slat Barrier."

For me, the choice is clear -- not only given Trump's track record, but because statistics also undermine his claims. First, despite what Trump wants you to believe, studies make it clear that immigrants, both undocumented and those legally here, are "considerably less likely to commit crime than native-born citizens." One study, conducted by the Cato Institute, found that "as a percentage of their respective populations, there were 56% fewer criminal convictions of illegal immigrants than of native-born Americans in Texas in 2015." On top of that, illegal border crossings are currently at their lowest levels since 2000. And nearly two thirds of those now in the country illegally are here because they overstayed their visas after arriving via airports, while others even came over the northern border from Canada. A massive southern border wall obviously won't address this.

Why Trump can't let go of his border wall dream (Opinion) - CNN

We have a very long, expensive history of walls & fences not working along the southern border. Democrats are following the advice of border security experts & agents who want to use high tech to secure the border. Something that can be seen (can)--and will always be compromised, something that can't be seen won't even be attempted.



I really don't think the half brained Trump tards are interested in border security as much as they are in trying to save Trump. Their right wing talk show hosts are telling them if Trump doesn't get the Trump WALL, it will be the end of his presidency. In reality, meaning the end of THEM because they shoved Trump down their throats over the wall.
November 28, 2018 - TRUMP'S GREAT WALL BECOMES TRUMP'S GREAT STALL

Climb this wall



View attachment 236503

Do you really believe that wall couldn't be compromised?

What liberties am I giving up if the wall is built?

I've answered that twice in this thread. READ IT. This repetitive stuff is for people that are too stupid to read OR cannot understand that the excuses for the wall have been refuted hundreds of times on this thread.

The excuses for not having a wall has been debunked a hundred times on this thread and the dozen or so just like it.

It won't work. How do you know until it's built?

It will take away our freedoms. How? Name me one freedom I would lose by a wall a thousand miles away from me.

It will be too authoritative and promote dictatorship. HTF can a wall change a country and politics?

It's racist. Why, because the people who are constantly sneaking into our country have different color skin, and it it were white people, we would be okay with invaders?

It won't stop drugs. Most of the heroin coming into the US is from Mexico.

They will dig tunnels. They dig tunnels now! Do you know how many months it takes to dig tunnels?

You're not interested at all in actual border security, you're just trying to save Trump's legacy.

Redirect to a comment from a Republican House member whose district in Texas is 800 miles of the border. Click here to redirect to the post on this thread
Why is Building the Wall Wrong?

It's a deterrent to fat ass Mexicans


.

I don't think there's too many fat Mexican's walking across deserts to climb walls and fences.

Yep no fat people.

The new wall should be built with no gripping points. If it is steel slats, they should be heavily greased making it impossible to grip to climb over.

 

[Wyatt earp]

Don't ever let any FACTS come up and bite you in the Ass--

This past week, Republican Rep. Will Hurd from Texas, a former CIA agent, slammed the "fallacy that a wall equals border security." He explained, "I have more border (in my district) than any other member of Congress, 820 miles," and added that we can use available technology to keep us far safer than a wall. Hurd closed with a key point: "Building a wall from sea to shining sea is the most expensive and least effective way to do border security."
But Trump refuses to accept that technology suggested by people like Hurd and others will address the problem. Instead, Trump on Sunday took to Twitter to mock that very concept, writing, "Drones and all of the rest are wonderful and lots of fun," he wrote, but the "only way to stop drug, gangs, human trafficking, criminal elements" is by building a "good old fashioned Wall" -- or, perhaps, a "Steel Slat Barrier."

For me, the choice is clear -- not only given Trump's track record, but because statistics also undermine his claims. First, despite what Trump wants you to believe, studies make it clear that immigrants, both undocumented and those legally here, are "considerably less likely to commit crime than native-born citizens." One study, conducted by the Cato Institute, found that "as a percentage of their respective populations, there were 56% fewer criminal convictions of illegal immigrants than of native-born Americans in Texas in 2015." On top of that, illegal border crossings are currently at their lowest levels since 2000. And nearly two thirds of those now in the country illegally are here because they overstayed their visas after arriving via airports, while others even came over the northern border from Canada. A massive southern border wall obviously won't address this.

Why Trump can't let go of his border wall dream (Opinion) - CNN

We have a very long, expensive history of walls & fences not working along the southern border. Democrats are following the advice of border security experts & agents who want to use high tech to secure the border. Something that can be seen (can)--and will always be compromised, something that can't be seen won't even be attempted.



I really don't think the half brained Trump tards are interested in border security as much as they are in trying to save Trump. Their right wing talk show hosts are telling them if Trump doesn't get the Trump WALL, it will be the end of his presidency. In reality, meaning the end of THEM because they shoved Trump down their throats over the wall.
November 28, 2018 - TRUMP'S GREAT WALL BECOMES TRUMP'S GREAT STALL

Climb this wall



View attachment 236503

Do you really believe that wall couldn't be compromised?

What liberties am I giving up if the wall is built?

I've answered that twice in this thread. READ IT. This repetitive stuff is for people that are too stupid to read OR cannot understand that the excuses for the wall have been refuted hundreds of times on this thread.

The excuses for not having a wall has been debunked a hundred times on this thread and the dozen or so just like it.

It won't work. How do you know until it's built?

It will take away our freedoms. How? Name me one freedom I would lose by a wall a thousand miles away from me.

It will be too authoritative and promote dictatorship. HTF can a wall change a country and politics?

It's racist. Why, because the people who are constantly sneaking into our country have different color skin, and it it were white people, we would be okay with invaders?

It won't stop drugs. Most of the heroin coming into the US is from Mexico.

They will dig tunnels. They dig tunnels now! Do you know how many months it takes to dig tunnels?

You're not interested at all in actual border security, you're just trying to save Trump's legacy.

Redirect to a comment from a Republican House member whose district in Texas is 800 miles of the border. Click here to redirect to the post on this thread
Why is Building the Wall Wrong?

It's a deterrent to fat ass Mexicans


.

I don't think there's too many fat Mexican's walking across deserts to climb walls and fences.

Yep no fat people.

Uhm because they can't climb it?.I see no old people or children either



Logic escapes you doesn't it ..


.

 

[JustAnotherNut]

This is taken from another thread......




If you really wanna know why a wall and border security is so important...….let me try to explain it to you...…..

Hypothetical Scenario...…..2 immigrant families come to America. Jose & his family went thru all the legal processes and are now citizens. Juan & his pregnant wife crossed the border at night and are here illegally.

Juan gets a construction job for $12 an hour tax free, cash under the table, roughly $1900 per month. His wife is only eligible for medical care...….until the triples are born. Then she receives $400-$600 cash for the 3 kids and $600-$800 in food stamps for the whole family including Juan. Plus medical care...…..for a total income of around $3400. ALL at taxpayer expense.

Jose and his wife both are working at McD's for $12 an hour each and take home roughly $1400 each, after taxes & SS. Now they have to pay childcare @ $1200 per month for their 3 kids...…...no welfare, no food stamps. Jose would love to get a construction job that pays $24 an hour so his wife could stay home with the kids...…...but he can't because Juan got it at a cheaper rate because he's illegal.



Is any of this getting thru???

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Do you really believe that wall couldn't be compromised?

Sure it could. So can prison fences. So can jails. It happens now and then. But the point is it makes it much more difficult for those that are hell bent on trying. For the rest, they will realize the efforts and risks are too great, and they payoff (if any) not worthy. Because even if they could draw the attention by getting past a wall, it likely won't be long until a border agent on the other side arrests them and sends them back to the other side.

 

[oreo]

A- Cost prohibitive
B- Won't work
C- It's racist
D- It would reduce those successfully crossing the border
E- None of the Above

The machine benefits by not having a wall. Business (Republicans) get their cheap labor and (Democrats) get the votes

You scratch my back, I'll scratch yours

There is no excuse for the Republicans not funding the wall.

-Geaux

What is wrong with building the wall? I voted for Trump. Trump is wrong, like the liberals. We need to tear down the border wall. What we really need make a national identity card. Linked to fingerprints. You don't get a job if you can't prove your identity linked to your real immigration status . Why Replicratrats are so opposed to that, boggles my mind.

Well, let me help you unboggle your mind. Why not start by reading Orwell's book 1984. It was a warning in the form of a novel.

The government big enough to give you all you want is big enough to take all you have... a quote by a famous Republican

Nobody on the right is asking the government to "give" us anything. We are asking the government to stop something that we citizens cannot stop by ourselves. Big difference.

Well you have an option.

1. Spend 47 BILLION dollars on a wall or steel slates that we know doesn't work
2. Go with the recommendations of border security experts and use high technology to secure the border. Something that would be more effective and cost efficient.



Just to remind everyone they found 240 of these in the San Diego Region alone.

The ins and outs of U.S.-Mexico border tunnels

If you choose Option # 1 it's not because you're interested in border security, it's because you're trying to protect Trump's legacy.

Now click this link to redirect to that message from a Texas Republican who has 820 miles of border and what he wants to do.
Why is Building the Wall Wrong?

 

[oreo]

Don't ever let any FACTS come up and bite you in the Ass--

Why Trump can't let go of his border wall dream (Opinion) - CNN

We have a very long, expensive history of walls & fences not working along the southern border. Democrats are following the advice of border security experts & agents who want to use high tech to secure the border. Something that can be seen (can)--and will always be compromised, something that can't be seen won't even be attempted.



I really don't think the half brained Trump tards are interested in border security as much as they are in trying to save Trump. Their right wing talk show hosts are telling them if Trump doesn't get the Trump WALL, it will be the end of his presidency. In reality, meaning the end of THEM because they shoved Trump down their throats over the wall.
November 28, 2018 - TRUMP'S GREAT WALL BECOMES TRUMP'S GREAT STALL

Climb this wall



View attachment 236503

Do you really believe that wall couldn't be compromised?

I've answered that twice in this thread. READ IT. This repetitive stuff is for people that are too stupid to read OR cannot understand that the excuses for the wall have been refuted hundreds of times on this thread.

The excuses for not having a wall has been debunked a hundred times on this thread and the dozen or so just like it.

It won't work. How do you know until it's built?

It will take away our freedoms. How? Name me one freedom I would lose by a wall a thousand miles away from me.

It will be too authoritative and promote dictatorship. HTF can a wall change a country and politics?

It's racist. Why, because the people who are constantly sneaking into our country have different color skin, and it it were white people, we would be okay with invaders?

It won't stop drugs. Most of the heroin coming into the US is from Mexico.

They will dig tunnels. They dig tunnels now! Do you know how many months it takes to dig tunnels?

You're not interested at all in actual border security, you're just trying to save Trump's legacy.

Redirect to a comment from a Republican House member whose district in Texas is 800 miles of the border. Click here to redirect to the post on this thread
Why is Building the Wall Wrong?

It's a deterrent to fat ass Mexicans


.

I don't think there's too many fat Mexican's walking across deserts to climb walls and fences.

Yep no fat people.

Uhm because they can't climb it?.I see no old people or children either



Logic escapes you doesn't it ..


.

If you would have actually read the article 2/3's of the illegals in this country flew in on visa's and overstayed their visas. And as you can see from the pictures, I really don't see a problem with bringing ropes and $2.00 dollar caribeaners to lift elderly, women and children up and over those fences & walls safely.

A couple drug mules here packing marijuana over a steel fence.

I see a woman in this one, and what looks like to be a couple of kids.

Look they built a platform on their side of the fence.

Just to keep in mind that every one of these type structures were designed specifically to keep people from getting over them. And we haven't even got to digging underneath them yet.

Which is explained at the end of this 2-1/2 minute video.


.

 

[Flopper]

Plenty of liberals have used the exact same arguments. There are no new arguments in this debate. Either your for the wall or you're against it. In the latter case, you lie to support your position. That's the bottom line.

The only thing you have not lied about thus far is that you're either for the wall or against it.

I'm against it and know there are better ways to secure the border. Admit it, you don't care about anything but the wall. You'd sell your soul for a wall. You don't even know what's being traded off in order to get it built.

No liberal has ever quoted me; I've never quoted a liberal and they do NOT make the same arguments I do.

You and the liberals are both against the wall because a wall would work. What more do we need to know?

The wall would work to expand the POLICE POWERS of the state at the expense of our God given Rights; it will NOT work because the United States of America is not a communist country; however, after you get your silly wall it will be.

Only Communist countries secure their borders? And how would a wall change an entire system of government?

Guess what? I won't lose one right if we get that border wall.......not one. Which rights do you think you'd be losing?

Nobody builds walls today, because they don't work, and they have never worked in all of history. They give a false sense of security, though.

Only a idiot would spend $25 billion dollars on something that has never worked throughout history. Even in Biblical times, Joshua fought the battle of Jericho and the walls came tumbling down! Look at all of the people who escaped from East Berlin, despite the Wall. The Great Wall of China was abandoned after the Ming Dynasty, which built most of the Great Wall we see today, because the last army that overran the Great Wall and defeated them thought it was a waste of time and money.

Gated communities - only in America. They tried them in Canada and they were a "no sale". We're not afraid of our neighbours. But I am reminded of the Trayvon Martin case. It was a gated community and yet it had been plagued by break-ins. That's why Zimmerman was following Trayvon - because he suspected the kid was casing properties for break-ins. If walls keep the bad guys out, why was Zimmerman patrolling the neighbourhood at all?

Like a fence, a wall can not stop intruders it can only delay them. A wall or reinforced fence will only delay intruders one to two minutes over standard fencing. Now that might be meaningful in more densely populated areas such as El Paso or San Diego/Tijuana where border patrols might only be a few minutes apart. However about 85% of the border is very remote and 1 or 2 additional minutes delay in crossing is not going to be significant since border patrols can be up to half hour or more apart in remote areas.

The most effective border security is a barrier wall or reinforced fence in more densely populated areas with simple reinforced border fencing with electronic monitoring and increased border patrols in more remote areas. This will save many billions over a 1000 mile or more border wall, increase apprehensions and could be completed in a reasonable period time. Plus it would likely get support from both parties.