Taxing The Rich

[danielpalos]

The dems don’t understand economics or even math.
They think that the rich are somehow locked into staying in high tax areas. They think that their money can’t be moved into other countries.
They don’t realize that businesses can leave money overseas Instead of bringing it into the U.S. where it spends just as well there.
They don’t realize that businesses are not going to take a hit to the bottom line, they will just pass that hit onto higher prices for the consumer.

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

Raise minimum wage to increase prices for goods. Then minimum wage purchases the exact same amount of goods or services.
so it ends up as a wash other then it looks good.

Yep. When you increase the minimum wage, you increase everyone else's wages because minimum wage by definition goes to the lowest value employees. So you have to pay the others proportionately more.

Then their companies raise prices and it all balances out again. Then a Democrat raises their hand and says I have an idea, let's increase the minimum wage ...

The problem is that's best case for low end workers, that it just doesn't work. The reality is that businesses constantly use those increased costs to streamline, optimize and automate processes. Which results in fewer low end jobs.

The low end workers are actually the victims of minimum wage increases. Democrats of course don't care, it was never about helping anyone. They want them to be poor so they stay Democrats

The left has a solution for that. Equal protection of the laws for unemployment compensation our at-will employment States.

What Daniel is trying to say is that he wants to be paid even if he refuses to work a job. He doesn't understand that at-will means you can quit and you can be fired, that's it.

What right wingers keep stating is that their bigotry not the law is what is important. At-will means at the will of either party not just the employer or the State.

No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility.

 

[danielpalos]

The dems don’t understand economics or even math.
They think that the rich are somehow locked into staying in high tax areas. They think that their money can’t be moved into other countries.
They don’t realize that businesses can leave money overseas Instead of bringing it into the U.S. where it spends just as well there.
They don’t realize that businesses are not going to take a hit to the bottom line, they will just pass that hit onto higher prices for the consumer.

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

Raise minimum wage to increase prices for goods. Then minimum wage purchases the exact same amount of goods or services.
so it ends up as a wash other then it looks good.

No, it doesn't. Some studies show less than five percent increase in prices. Simply beating the rate of inflation means greater purchasing power for Labor and their propensity to consume. The doubling of the minimum wage will not result in a doubling of prices for anything.

So you're going to increase labor costs by 100% but claim that prices will only go up 5%? You're not the brightest bulb on the tree...are you, Daniel?

Due to minimum wage increases. Other wages could raise it more, but the pay increases need merely beat inflation. Who cares if prices go up if we can afford it with the higher wage. And, a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage also generates several times more in federal income tax revenue.

Answer this honestly, Daniel. Why stop there? Let's just raise it to $100/hr and eliminate poverty altogether. Why not?

Because, even slavery and no minimum wage laws did not solve the problem of poverty, it just made it, "ok".

 

[danielpalos]

"Above all things, good policy is to be used that the treasure and monies in a state be not gathered into few hands. For otherwise a state may have a great stock, and yet starve. And money is like muck, not good except it be spread"
-- Francis Bacon; from 'Of Seditions and Troubles'

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

You just don’t get it. Raise minimum wage prices go up. So the only thing you are doing is making the poor slob have less money in their pocket because of taxes. So I guess you want people to either stop working or have less money to spend

Prices have been going up anyway; only the minimum wage was not being raised on a regular basis to keep up with inflation.

I don’t know where you live but where most people live the cost of labor has been going up. In my area you can go to work at McDonalds for more then minimum wage.
Minimum wage of $15.00 an hour will not get you the same things as other areas.
I know that you are unable to comprehend this but why not allow states to set minimum wage since they understand their economy better then the federal government? Oh I know because then the federal government would not be in charge of everything in people’s lives

Then why complain about the less than five percent who work minimum wage jobs getting a higher statutory minimum wage that is a simple cost of living adjustment?

You're ignoring the ripple effect. More than half the work force makes $20/hr or less. All of them would demand a raise. Add to that everyone who now makes between $7 and $15, and no, it's not 5%.

A cost of living adjustment. Or, stop complaining that the Poor don't pay enough in taxes or cost too much in social services.

 

[danielpalos]

The dems don’t understand economics or even math.
They think that the rich are somehow locked into staying in high tax areas. They think that their money can’t be moved into other countries.
They don’t realize that businesses can leave money overseas Instead of bringing it into the U.S. where it spends just as well there.
They don’t realize that businesses are not going to take a hit to the bottom line, they will just pass that hit onto higher prices for the consumer.

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

Raise minimum wage to increase prices for goods. Then minimum wage purchases the exact same amount of goods or services.
so it ends up as a wash other then it looks good.

No, it doesn't. Some studies show less than five percent increase in prices. Simply beating the rate of inflation means greater purchasing power for Labor and their propensity to consume. The doubling of the minimum wage will not result in a doubling of prices for anything.

So you're going to increase labor costs by 100% but claim that prices will only go up 5%? You're not the brightest bulb on the tree...are you, Daniel?

Due to minimum wage increases. Other wages could raise it more, but the pay increases need merely beat inflation. Who cares if prices go up if we can afford it with the higher wage. And, a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage also generates several times more in federal income tax revenue.

How does this work, Daniel? The profit margin of your typical brick and mortar store is less than 5%. Their largest expense will typically be payroll which you're now increasing by 100%. So where do you make up the difference?

Prices won't double even if the minimum wage does. The multiplier effect does the rest.

I asked a rather simple question, Daniel...which you've failed to answer. How do you raise labor costs 100% in a business that only has a 5% profit margin and NOT raise the price of goods and services provided by that business?

It is about the minimum wage and minimum wage labor. What percentage of any workforce makes the minimum wage?

Answer the question, Daniel. If you can't...then admit you have no clue what you're talking about...tuck tail and find another string!

You are the one begging the question. You have nothing but Hoax not any understanding of economics.

So your "answer" to a very simple question...is that I have "Hoax"? If you can't answer something that basic, Daniel then it's obvious your minimum wage ideas fall flat on their face.

I took Economics classes at UMass, Amherst College and Boston University. What is your background on the subject?

I'd give it up. You'll never get anything but empty rhetoric from Danny Boy

lol. You have nothing but Hoax, not any valid arguments for rebuttal.

Awwwwk! Polly wanna hoaxcracker!

Still no valid arguments. How many times do I have to repeat myself to get a valid response from right wingers?

Okay here's one. If a lazy Dem dreg needs more money, then tell him to get a job or a better one if by accident he already has one. Raising minimum wage makes the dregs dreggier.

Raising the minimum wage means more federal income tax revenue for Government.

Why? The dregs milk the system for every dollar they can get even better than the uberrich. Consumer prices go up and any taxes the dregs pay are miniscule if at all.

Not at all. A fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage generates several times more in federal income tax revenue. So what if the employer cuts a few jobs. The unemployed should be able to obtain unemployment compensation for as long as they want.

And there it is, the admission that you want to get paid even if you refuse to work a job. What you want is welfare, not unemployment compensation.

Nobody takes right wingers seriously about economics or the law. Equal protect of the law is not means tested welfare. Only the right wing, never gets it but want to be taken "morally seriously" anyway with nothing but Hoax.

 

[danielpalos]

The dems don’t understand economics or even math.
They think that the rich are somehow locked into staying in high tax areas. They think that their money can’t be moved into other countries.
They don’t realize that businesses can leave money overseas Instead of bringing it into the U.S. where it spends just as well there.
They don’t realize that businesses are not going to take a hit to the bottom line, they will just pass that hit onto higher prices for the consumer.

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

How are you going to increase the value of that job when it's not worth the increased wage?

By moving the goal posts via the socialism of Government with our fiat money. The value of any minimum wage labor is what Government says it is. Capitalist simply need to review their accounting to make a profit.

You have absolutely no idea how a business actually operates, do you? You can't if you think you can arbitrarily increase costs and the company won't do anything about it.

That is your straw man argument. Capitalists merely need to review their accounting to make a profit is my rebuttal.

 

[danielpalos]

The dems don’t understand economics or even math.
They think that the rich are somehow locked into staying in high tax areas. They think that their money can’t be moved into other countries.
They don’t realize that businesses can leave money overseas Instead of bringing it into the U.S. where it spends just as well there.
They don’t realize that businesses are not going to take a hit to the bottom line, they will just pass that hit onto higher prices for the consumer.

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

Raise minimum wage to increase prices for goods. Then minimum wage purchases the exact same amount of goods or services.
so it ends up as a wash other then it looks good.

No, it doesn't. Some studies show less than five percent increase in prices. Simply beating the rate of inflation means greater purchasing power for Labor and their propensity to consume. The doubling of the minimum wage will not result in a doubling of prices for anything.

So you're going to increase labor costs by 100% but claim that prices will only go up 5%? You're not the brightest bulb on the tree...are you, Daniel?

Due to minimum wage increases. Other wages could raise it more, but the pay increases need merely beat inflation. Who cares if prices go up if we can afford it with the higher wage. And, a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage also generates several times more in federal income tax revenue.

How does this work, Daniel? The profit margin of your typical brick and mortar store is less than 5%. Their largest expense will typically be payroll which you're now increasing by 100%. So where do you make up the difference?

Prices won't double even if the minimum wage does. The multiplier effect does the rest.

I asked a rather simple question, Daniel...which you've failed to answer. How do you raise labor costs 100% in a business that only has a 5% profit margin and NOT raise the price of goods and services provided by that business?

It is about the minimum wage and minimum wage labor. What percentage of any workforce makes the minimum wage?

Answer the question, Daniel. If you can't...then admit you have no clue what you're talking about...tuck tail and find another string!

You are the one begging the question. You have nothing but Hoax not any understanding of economics.

So your "answer" to a very simple question...is that I have "Hoax"? If you can't answer something that basic, Daniel then it's obvious your minimum wage ideas fall flat on their face.

I took Economics classes at UMass, Amherst College and Boston University. What is your background on the subject?

And apparently, you learned nothing. Why brag?

I'm not bragging. I'm simply pointing out that I understand Economics because it was a subject I studied in college. You on the other hand post gibberish when it comes to economic theory. Which led me to ask what your background is in the subject! One more question which you avoided like it was Kryptonite!

All you do is allege you took economics in college. Where are your valid arguments and thesis?

I don't "allege" that I took Economics in college! I did. Most college undergraduates have. I'm assuming at this point that you never attended college?

On what basis? You have no valid arguments only the fallacy of argumentum ad hominem. I could assume you are simply full of Hoax not valid arguments.

 

[BluesLegend]

The Democrat plans to tax the rich are futile and ignorant.

Hell the first thing Dems are going to do is give the rich a tax cut. Biden, Pelosi, and Schumer have vowed to get rid of Trump's SALT cap which is a huge tax cut almost entirely benefiting the rich and well off. Whenever Dems are talking assume they are lying.

 

[danielpalos]

The Democrat plans to tax the rich are futile and ignorant. They sound good to the uneducated, but they don't work very well. When you raise tax rates or reduce deductions on the rich, their typical response is to divert more of their money into tax shelters where they pay less tax. They can afford tax lawyers and CPAs who find ways to reduce their taxes dramatically and it's all legal.

Donald Trump knows how. For several years at a time, he paid no income tax. I don't know all the shelters he used but I can guess. One would be accelerated depreciation on the buildings and furniture he owns. Another would be Net Loss Carryover. When you have a loss in one year, the IRS Code allows you to deduct that loss on the returns for following years. If the NLC is large enough, it can give you zero tax liability for 5 or 6 years. Even people of moderate income can use tax shelters. I have 2 of them.

If you don't try and target the rich, they will pay a fair share of taxes just like everybody else. If you target them with high tax rates, they run for tax shelters.

These Dem idiots never learned what Kennedy, Reagan and Trump learned. Cutting taxes puts more money into the economy and the Fed coffers than raising them ever did. They will never, ever learn that lesson.

Imbeciles is what they are.

Trickle down economics has never worked, but it does enrich the rich enormously.

Trickle down economics doesn't work...BECAUSE TRICKLE DOWN ECONOMICS DOESN'T EXIST! It's something that was made up by the left to denigrate Supply Side Economics. Whenever someone starts talking about trickle down economics it's a sure sign they don't have a clue about economics in general!

Lol. Trickle down economics is just another name for supply side economics. You must know that right?

No...it's not! If you took Economics you'd know that, Gipper! "Trickle Down Economics" is a pejorative term coined by the left to describe Supply Side Economics in a derogatory fashion.

Well, yes. It’s a pejorative for SUPPLY SIDE ECONOMICS. semantics?

It's not semantics! It describes something that doesn't occur. Profits do not trickle down in any business model I've ever seen. Ownership is always the last to be paid and quite often isn't paid at all.

Only lousy capitalists have that problem. Corporate welfare has even paid multimillion dollar bonuses.

 

[danielpalos]

The dems don’t understand economics or even math.
They think that the rich are somehow locked into staying in high tax areas. They think that their money can’t be moved into other countries.
They don’t realize that businesses can leave money overseas Instead of bringing it into the U.S. where it spends just as well there.
They don’t realize that businesses are not going to take a hit to the bottom line, they will just pass that hit onto higher prices for the consumer.

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

Raise minimum wage to increase prices for goods. Then minimum wage purchases the exact same amount of goods or services.
so it ends up as a wash other then it looks good.

No, it doesn't. Some studies show less than five percent increase in prices. Simply beating the rate of inflation means greater purchasing power for Labor and their propensity to consume. The doubling of the minimum wage will not result in a doubling of prices for anything.

So you're going to increase labor costs by 100% but claim that prices will only go up 5%? You're not the brightest bulb on the tree...are you, Daniel?

Due to minimum wage increases. Other wages could raise it more, but the pay increases need merely beat inflation. Who cares if prices go up if we can afford it with the higher wage. And, a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage also generates several times more in federal income tax revenue.

How does this work, Daniel? The profit margin of your typical brick and mortar store is less than 5%. Their largest expense will typically be payroll which you're now increasing by 100%. So where do you make up the difference?

Prices won't double even if the minimum wage does. The multiplier effect does the rest.

I asked a rather simple question, Daniel...which you've failed to answer. How do you raise labor costs 100% in a business that only has a 5% profit margin and NOT raise the price of goods and services provided by that business?

It is about the minimum wage and minimum wage labor. What percentage of any workforce makes the minimum wage?

Answer the question, Daniel. If you can't...then admit you have no clue what you're talking about...tuck tail and find another string!

You are the one begging the question. You have nothing but Hoax not any understanding of economics.

So your "answer" to a very simple question...is that I have "Hoax"? If you can't answer something that basic, Daniel then it's obvious your minimum wage ideas fall flat on their face.

I took Economics classes at UMass, Amherst College and Boston University. What is your background on the subject?

I'd give it up. You'll never get anything but empty rhetoric from Danny Boy

He wants to know what my "thesis" is on the subject? Daniel's dumb as a box of rocks.

I am the one resorting to the fewest fallacies not You. Who must be the dumbest?

 

[danielpalos]

”The trouble with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.” - Margaret Thatcher

We should abolish our socialist and allege right wing wars on crime, drugs, and terror before we run out of the People's money.

 

[danielpalos]

The dems don’t understand economics or even math.
They think that the rich are somehow locked into staying in high tax areas. They think that their money can’t be moved into other countries.
They don’t realize that businesses can leave money overseas Instead of bringing it into the U.S. where it spends just as well there.
They don’t realize that businesses are not going to take a hit to the bottom line, they will just pass that hit onto higher prices for the consumer.

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

Raise minimum wage to increase prices for goods. Then minimum wage purchases the exact same amount of goods or services.
so it ends up as a wash other then it looks good.

No, it doesn't. Some studies show less than five percent increase in prices. Simply beating the rate of inflation means greater purchasing power for Labor and their propensity to consume. The doubling of the minimum wage will not result in a doubling of prices for anything.

So you're going to increase labor costs by 100% but claim that prices will only go up 5%? You're not the brightest bulb on the tree...are you, Daniel?

Due to minimum wage increases. Other wages could raise it more, but the pay increases need merely beat inflation. Who cares if prices go up if we can afford it with the higher wage. And, a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage also generates several times more in federal income tax revenue.

How does this work, Daniel? The profit margin of your typical brick and mortar store is less than 5%. Their largest expense will typically be payroll which you're now increasing by 100%. So where do you make up the difference?

Prices won't double even if the minimum wage does. The multiplier effect does the rest.

I asked a rather simple question, Daniel...which you've failed to answer. How do you raise labor costs 100% in a business that only has a 5% profit margin and NOT raise the price of goods and services provided by that business?

It is about the minimum wage and minimum wage labor. What percentage of any workforce makes the minimum wage?

Answer the question, Daniel. If you can't...then admit you have no clue what you're talking about...tuck tail and find another string!

You are the one begging the question. You have nothing but Hoax not any understanding of economics.

So your "answer" to a very simple question...is that I have "Hoax"? If you can't answer something that basic, Daniel then it's obvious your minimum wage ideas fall flat on their face.

I took Economics classes at UMass, Amherst College and Boston University. What is your background on the subject?

I'd give it up. You'll never get anything but empty rhetoric from Danny Boy

He wants to know what my "thesis" is on the subject? Daniel's dumb as a box of rocks.

I put him on ignore years ago. The empty rhetoric never stops ever

I don't need to ignore anyone. I resort to the fewest fallacies. Those who have the emptiest rhetoric have nothing but fallacy not any valid arguments. Oldstyle merely likes to resort to ad hominems not valid rebuttal and thinks he is Right simply because he is on the right wing not because he has any valid arguments.

 

[Oldestyle]

The dems don’t understand economics or even math.
They think that the rich are somehow locked into staying in high tax areas. They think that their money can’t be moved into other countries.
They don’t realize that businesses can leave money overseas Instead of bringing it into the U.S. where it spends just as well there.
They don’t realize that businesses are not going to take a hit to the bottom line, they will just pass that hit onto higher prices for the consumer.

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

Raise minimum wage to increase prices for goods. Then minimum wage purchases the exact same amount of goods or services.
so it ends up as a wash other then it looks good.

Yep. When you increase the minimum wage, you increase everyone else's wages because minimum wage by definition goes to the lowest value employees. So you have to pay the others proportionately more.

Then their companies raise prices and it all balances out again. Then a Democrat raises their hand and says I have an idea, let's increase the minimum wage ...

The problem is that's best case for low end workers, that it just doesn't work. The reality is that businesses constantly use those increased costs to streamline, optimize and automate processes. Which results in fewer low end jobs.

The low end workers are actually the victims of minimum wage increases. Democrats of course don't care, it was never about helping anyone. They want them to be poor so they stay Democrats

Can you show some evidence that when the minimum wage is raised all wages go up? Do you really believe that?

Al? Use your head for something other than a hat rack! A little common sense? If you make $15 an hour as my manager at Burger World do you think you'll be satisfied making that same $15 an hour if I get a raise to $15 as well? Of course not! Common sense tells you that anytime you raise the bottom rung of a pay scale...you HAVE to raise the rungs above that bottom rung!

 

[Oldestyle]

The dems don’t understand economics or even math.
They think that the rich are somehow locked into staying in high tax areas. They think that their money can’t be moved into other countries.
They don’t realize that businesses can leave money overseas Instead of bringing it into the U.S. where it spends just as well there.
They don’t realize that businesses are not going to take a hit to the bottom line, they will just pass that hit onto higher prices for the consumer.

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

Raise minimum wage to increase prices for goods. Then minimum wage purchases the exact same amount of goods or services.
so it ends up as a wash other then it looks good.

No, it doesn't. Some studies show less than five percent increase in prices. Simply beating the rate of inflation means greater purchasing power for Labor and their propensity to consume. The doubling of the minimum wage will not result in a doubling of prices for anything.

So you're going to increase labor costs by 100% but claim that prices will only go up 5%? You're not the brightest bulb on the tree...are you, Daniel?

Due to minimum wage increases. Other wages could raise it more, but the pay increases need merely beat inflation. Who cares if prices go up if we can afford it with the higher wage. And, a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage also generates several times more in federal income tax revenue.

How does this work, Daniel? The profit margin of your typical brick and mortar store is less than 5%. Their largest expense will typically be payroll which you're now increasing by 100%. So where do you make up the difference?

Prices won't double even if the minimum wage does. The multiplier effect does the rest.

I asked a rather simple question, Daniel...which you've failed to answer. How do you raise labor costs 100% in a business that only has a 5% profit margin and NOT raise the price of goods and services provided by that business?

It is about the minimum wage and minimum wage labor. What percentage of any workforce makes the minimum wage?

Answer the question, Daniel. If you can't...then admit you have no clue what you're talking about...tuck tail and find another string!

You are the one begging the question. You have nothing but Hoax not any understanding of economics.

So your "answer" to a very simple question...is that I have "Hoax"? If you can't answer something that basic, Daniel then it's obvious your minimum wage ideas fall flat on their face.

I took Economics classes at UMass, Amherst College and Boston University. What is your background on the subject?

I'd give it up. You'll never get anything but empty rhetoric from Danny Boy

He wants to know what my "thesis" is on the subject? Daniel's dumb as a box of rocks.

I put him on ignore years ago. The empty rhetoric never stops ever

I don't need to ignore anyone. I resort to the fewest fallacies. Those who have the emptiest rhetoric have nothing but fallacy not any valid arguments. Oldstyle merely likes to resort to ad hominems not valid rebuttal and thinks he is Right simply because he is on the right wing not because he has any valid arguments.

You've made a valid argument? When? You've become a joke, Daniel...you're just too dense to recognize that fact! "Hoax"? "Thesis"? "Ad hominem"? "Fallacies"? You babble like Joe Biden when he loses his place on the teleprompter. Things are coming out of your mouth but none of it makes a lick of sense!

 

[danielpalos]

The dems don’t understand economics or even math.
They think that the rich are somehow locked into staying in high tax areas. They think that their money can’t be moved into other countries.
They don’t realize that businesses can leave money overseas Instead of bringing it into the U.S. where it spends just as well there.
They don’t realize that businesses are not going to take a hit to the bottom line, they will just pass that hit onto higher prices for the consumer.

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

Raise minimum wage to increase prices for goods. Then minimum wage purchases the exact same amount of goods or services.
so it ends up as a wash other then it looks good.

No, it doesn't. Some studies show less than five percent increase in prices. Simply beating the rate of inflation means greater purchasing power for Labor and their propensity to consume. The doubling of the minimum wage will not result in a doubling of prices for anything.

So you're going to increase labor costs by 100% but claim that prices will only go up 5%? You're not the brightest bulb on the tree...are you, Daniel?

Due to minimum wage increases. Other wages could raise it more, but the pay increases need merely beat inflation. Who cares if prices go up if we can afford it with the higher wage. And, a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage also generates several times more in federal income tax revenue.

How does this work, Daniel? The profit margin of your typical brick and mortar store is less than 5%. Their largest expense will typically be payroll which you're now increasing by 100%. So where do you make up the difference?

Prices won't double even if the minimum wage does. The multiplier effect does the rest.

I asked a rather simple question, Daniel...which you've failed to answer. How do you raise labor costs 100% in a business that only has a 5% profit margin and NOT raise the price of goods and services provided by that business?

It is about the minimum wage and minimum wage labor. What percentage of any workforce makes the minimum wage?

Answer the question, Daniel. If you can't...then admit you have no clue what you're talking about...tuck tail and find another string!

You are the one begging the question. You have nothing but Hoax not any understanding of economics.

So your "answer" to a very simple question...is that I have "Hoax"? If you can't answer something that basic, Daniel then it's obvious your minimum wage ideas fall flat on their face.

I took Economics classes at UMass, Amherst College and Boston University. What is your background on the subject?

I'd give it up. You'll never get anything but empty rhetoric from Danny Boy

He wants to know what my "thesis" is on the subject? Daniel's dumb as a box of rocks.

I put him on ignore years ago. The empty rhetoric never stops ever

I don't need to ignore anyone. I resort to the fewest fallacies. Those who have the emptiest rhetoric have nothing but fallacy not any valid arguments. Oldstyle merely likes to resort to ad hominems not valid rebuttal and thinks he is Right simply because he is on the right wing not because he has any valid arguments.

You've made a valid argument? When? You've become a joke, Daniel...you're just too dense to recognize that fact! "Hoax"? "Thesis"? "Ad hominem"? "Fallacies"? You babble like Joe Biden when he loses his place on the teleprompter. Things are coming out of your mouth but none of it makes a lick of sense!

You have to explain why I am full of fallacy not just allege it. That is the whole and entire difference.

 

[danielpalos]

The dems don’t understand economics or even math.
They think that the rich are somehow locked into staying in high tax areas. They think that their money can’t be moved into other countries.
They don’t realize that businesses can leave money overseas Instead of bringing it into the U.S. where it spends just as well there.
They don’t realize that businesses are not going to take a hit to the bottom line, they will just pass that hit onto higher prices for the consumer.

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

Raise minimum wage to increase prices for goods. Then minimum wage purchases the exact same amount of goods or services.
so it ends up as a wash other then it looks good.

Yep. When you increase the minimum wage, you increase everyone else's wages because minimum wage by definition goes to the lowest value employees. So you have to pay the others proportionately more.

Then their companies raise prices and it all balances out again. Then a Democrat raises their hand and says I have an idea, let's increase the minimum wage ...

The problem is that's best case for low end workers, that it just doesn't work. The reality is that businesses constantly use those increased costs to streamline, optimize and automate processes. Which results in fewer low end jobs.

The low end workers are actually the victims of minimum wage increases. Democrats of course don't care, it was never about helping anyone. They want them to be poor so they stay Democrats

Can you show some evidence that when the minimum wage is raised all wages go up? Do you really believe that?

Al? Use your head for something other than a hat rack! A little common sense? If you make $15 an hour as my manager at Burger World do you think you'll be satisfied making that same $15 an hour if I get a raise to $15 as well? Of course not! Common sense tells you that anytime you raise the bottom rung of a pay scale...you HAVE to raise the rungs above that bottom rung!

An institutional upward pressure on wages, what a concept; or, employment is at-will, just quit and get a better job, right winger.

 

[ReinyDays]

The Democrat plans to tax the rich are futile and ignorant. They sound good to the uneducated, but they don't work very well. When you raise tax rates or reduce deductions on the rich, their typical response is to divert more of their money into tax shelters where they pay less tax. They can afford tax lawyers and CPAs who find ways to reduce their taxes dramatically and it's all legal.

Donald Trump knows how. For several years at a time, he paid no income tax. I don't know all the shelters he used but I can guess. One would be accelerated depreciation on the buildings and furniture he owns. Another would be Net Loss Carryover. When you have a loss in one year, the IRS Code allows you to deduct that loss on the returns for following years. If the NLC is large enough, it can give you zero tax liability for 5 or 6 years. Even people of moderate income can use tax shelters. I have 2 of them.

If you don't try and target the rich, they will pay a fair share of taxes just like everybody else. If you target them with high tax rates, they run for tax shelters.

Sorry I'm late for dinner ... and perhaps repeating what others have already said ...

accelerated depreciation on the buildings and furniture

The is a RED FLAG ... sorry ... depreciation is a normal part of the business activity ... all of us can deduct the depreciation expense for these items and many many more that are used for business and/or "the production of revenue" ... we're taxed on profit ( = revenue - expenses ) ... furniture cost can typically be deducted the year the expense is incurred under Section 179, most everything else can be depreciated using one of several accelerated methods, the greatest loss of value occurs in the first year ... but buildings must always be depreciated using the straight-line method ... the important point here is that depreciation is a normal activity for businesses, a thing to do to keep the accounting records accurate ... so this is convenient to base taxes on ... for the cause of having exact depreciation numbers in hand, we have the effect of allowing a tax deduction for depreciation ... not the other way around ...

The main problem with the OP is the thought that The Rich don't already have all their money in tax shelters ... rare is the person who would bring money into their personal accounts and pay the earned income rate of 38% rather than bring the money in as dividend income rate of 20% ... (thanks Obama) ...

My income is almost all capital gains ... of which the first million or so in any single year isn't taxed at all ... and 20% (thanks Obama) there after ... it's tough trying to make ends meet on only $1 million per year, the horrors of having to fly a Cessna instead of a Lear Jet ... that's the price someone like me has to pay to keep the tax load zeroed ...

Middle Class wage-slaves, the salaried and small business owners start off with a 15% SS tax, and if they can finagle their way into the 19% income tax bracket, well that's still 1/3 their income ... to the IRS ... most Middle Class never see this money, their employers deduct it off their paychecks and sends it to the IRS on the employee's behalf ...

Why would someone paying 1/3 their income in taxes think it's okay for The Rich to pay nothing, or less than 10%? ... some Republicans get downright rabid about this ... "making The Rich pay their fair share will destroy the US economy" ... whereas taxing the Middle Class out of existence won't? ... I don't get it myself, but as long as it's there, I'll be taking advantage ... you should too ...

I liken this to The Rich kicking the Middle Class in the groin generation after generation, and the Middle Class saying "thank you sir, may I please have another" generation after generation ... maybe we should be taxing the Middle Class out of existence ... they're kinda useless except for cannon fodder ... as long as the Middle Class self-identify as cannon fodder, The Rich will be happy to make their dreams come true ...

 

[danielpalos]

The Democrat plans to tax the rich are futile and ignorant. They sound good to the uneducated, but they don't work very well. When you raise tax rates or reduce deductions on the rich, their typical response is to divert more of their money into tax shelters where they pay less tax. They can afford tax lawyers and CPAs who find ways to reduce their taxes dramatically and it's all legal.

Donald Trump knows how. For several years at a time, he paid no income tax. I don't know all the shelters he used but I can guess. One would be accelerated depreciation on the buildings and furniture he owns. Another would be Net Loss Carryover. When you have a loss in one year, the IRS Code allows you to deduct that loss on the returns for following years. If the NLC is large enough, it can give you zero tax liability for 5 or 6 years. Even people of moderate income can use tax shelters. I have 2 of them.

If you don't try and target the rich, they will pay a fair share of taxes just like everybody else. If you target them with high tax rates, they run for tax shelters.

Sorry I'm late for dinner ... and perhaps repeating what others have already said ...

accelerated depreciation on the buildings and furniture

The is a RED FLAG ... sorry ... depreciation is a normal part of the business activity ... all of us can deduct the depreciation expense for these items and many many more that are used for business and/or "the production of revenue" ... we're taxed on profit ( = revenue - expenses ) ... furniture cost can typically be deducted the year the expense is incurred under Section 179, most everything else can be depreciated using one of several accelerated methods, the greatest loss of value occurs in the first year ... but buildings must always be depreciated using the straight-line method ... the important point here is that depreciation is a normal activity for businesses, a thing to do to keep the accounting records accurate ... so this is convenient to base taxes on ... for the cause of having exact depreciation numbers in hand, we have the effect of allowing a tax deduction for depreciation ... not the other way around ...

The main problem with the OP is the thought that The Rich don't already have all their money in tax shelters ... rare is the person who would bring money into their personal accounts and pay the earned income rate of 38% rather than bring the money in as dividend income rate of 20% ... (thanks Obama) ...

My income is almost all capital gains ... of which the first million or so in any single year isn't taxed at all ... and 20% (thanks Obama) there after ... it's tough trying to make ends meet on only $1 million per year, the horrors of having to fly a Cessna instead of a Lear Jet ... that's the price someone like me has to pay to keep the tax load zeroed ...

Middle Class wage-slaves, the salaried and small business owners start off with a 15% SS tax, and if they can finagle their way into the 19% income tax bracket, well that's still 1/3 their income ... to the IRS ... most Middle Class never see this money, their employers deduct it off their paychecks and sends it to the IRS on the employee's behalf ...

Why would someone paying 1/3 their income in taxes think it's okay for The Rich to pay nothing, or less than 10%? ... some Republicans get downright rabid about this ... "making The Rich pay their fair share will destroy the US economy" ... whereas taxing the Middle Class out of existence won't? ... I don't get it myself, but as long as it's there, I'll be taking advantage ... you should too ...

I liken this to The Rich kicking the Middle Class in the groin generation after generation, and the Middle Class saying "thank you sir, may I please have another" generation after generation ... maybe we should be taxing the Middle Class out of existence ... they're kinda useless except for cannon fodder ... as long as the Middle Class self-identify as cannon fodder, The Rich will be happy to make their dreams come true ...

What is wrong with raising the minimum wage to create that Institutional upward pressure on wages to meet or beat inflation? Higher paid labor creates more in demand and generates more in tax revenue in any long run equilibrium; the multiplier effect. The Poor tend to have the largest marginal propensity to consume with their income.

 

[Rogue AI]

The dems don’t understand economics or even math.
They think that the rich are somehow locked into staying in high tax areas. They think that their money can’t be moved into other countries.
They don’t realize that businesses can leave money overseas Instead of bringing it into the U.S. where it spends just as well there.
They don’t realize that businesses are not going to take a hit to the bottom line, they will just pass that hit onto higher prices for the consumer.

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

Raise minimum wage to increase prices for goods. Then minimum wage purchases the exact same amount of goods or services.
so it ends up as a wash other then it looks good.

Yep. When you increase the minimum wage, you increase everyone else's wages because minimum wage by definition goes to the lowest value employees. So you have to pay the others proportionately more.

Then their companies raise prices and it all balances out again. Then a Democrat raises their hand and says I have an idea, let's increase the minimum wage ...

The problem is that's best case for low end workers, that it just doesn't work. The reality is that businesses constantly use those increased costs to streamline, optimize and automate processes. Which results in fewer low end jobs.

The low end workers are actually the victims of minimum wage increases. Democrats of course don't care, it was never about helping anyone. They want them to be poor so they stay Democrats

Can you show some evidence that when the minimum wage is raised all wages go up? Do you really believe that?

Al? Use your head for something other than a hat rack! A little common sense? If you make $15 an hour as my manager at Burger World do you think you'll be satisfied making that same $15 an hour if I get a raise to $15 as well? Of course not! Common sense tells you that anytime you raise the bottom rung of a pay scale...you HAVE to raise the rungs above that bottom rung!

Way to ignore the radical increase in overhead. A drastic increase in the minimum wage will create a class of minimum wage workers for years. All the people below the minimum now will never see another raise. There are a lot more folks flipping the burgers than managing the store.

 

[ReinyDays]

What is wrong with raising the minimum wage to create that Institutional upward pressure on wages to meet or beat inflation? Higher paid labor creates more in demand and generates more in tax revenue in any long run equilibrium; the multiplier effect. The Poor tend to have the largest marginal propensity to consume with their income.

I have absolutely no reason to hire someone unless I see profit from that employee ... if I'm paying him $10/hr, I should see a $5/hr profit, money into MY pocket ... you want me to raise his wage to $15/hr, and see MY profit disappear? ... I'm laying that worker off, not worth the effort to keep him employed ... or raise my prices to cover the extra $5/hr (plus margins) ...

Wages go up, prices go up ... the definition of inflation ... that new $15 only buys the same as the old $10 did ... the worker sees no benefit ... whereas these extra margins increases MY buying power ... I wished it worked that way, but it doesn't ... I'm still better off expanding my business and hiring more $10/hr workers ... keep inflation down, interest rates down ... keep minimum wage at $10/hr ... more people benefit with jobs, and I benefit with more revenue, same expenses, which means more profit ...

The Poor rent? ... landlords across the nation know how to raise rents ... the worker earns $800 more per month, their rents go up $400 ... easy peasy ... I set up a spreadsheet calculator where I inputted the SS COL, find the dollar amount each of my tenants would see in their monthly checks, then raise rents that amount ... that MY cost of living increase, not yours ...

 

[kaz]

The dems don’t understand economics or even math.
They think that the rich are somehow locked into staying in high tax areas. They think that their money can’t be moved into other countries.
They don’t realize that businesses can leave money overseas Instead of bringing it into the U.S. where it spends just as well there.
They don’t realize that businesses are not going to take a hit to the bottom line, they will just pass that hit onto higher prices for the consumer.

Raise the minimum wage to raise more tax revenue.

Raise minimum wage to increase prices for goods. Then minimum wage purchases the exact same amount of goods or services.
so it ends up as a wash other then it looks good.

No, it doesn't. Some studies show less than five percent increase in prices. Simply beating the rate of inflation means greater purchasing power for Labor and their propensity to consume. The doubling of the minimum wage will not result in a doubling of prices for anything.

So you're going to increase labor costs by 100% but claim that prices will only go up 5%? You're not the brightest bulb on the tree...are you, Daniel?

Due to minimum wage increases. Other wages could raise it more, but the pay increases need merely beat inflation. Who cares if prices go up if we can afford it with the higher wage. And, a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage also generates several times more in federal income tax revenue.

How does this work, Daniel? The profit margin of your typical brick and mortar store is less than 5%. Their largest expense will typically be payroll which you're now increasing by 100%. So where do you make up the difference?

Prices won't double even if the minimum wage does. The multiplier effect does the rest.

I asked a rather simple question, Daniel...which you've failed to answer. How do you raise labor costs 100% in a business that only has a 5% profit margin and NOT raise the price of goods and services provided by that business?

It is about the minimum wage and minimum wage labor. What percentage of any workforce makes the minimum wage?

Answer the question, Daniel. If you can't...then admit you have no clue what you're talking about...tuck tail and find another string!

You are the one begging the question. You have nothing but Hoax not any understanding of economics.

So your "answer" to a very simple question...is that I have "Hoax"? If you can't answer something that basic, Daniel then it's obvious your minimum wage ideas fall flat on their face.

I took Economics classes at UMass, Amherst College and Boston University. What is your background on the subject?

I'd give it up. You'll never get anything but empty rhetoric from Danny Boy

He wants to know what my "thesis" is on the subject? Daniel's dumb as a box of rocks.

I put him on ignore years ago. The empty rhetoric never stops ever

I don't need to ignore anyone. I resort to the fewest fallacies. Those who have the emptiest rhetoric have nothing but fallacy not any valid arguments. Oldstyle merely likes to resort to ad hominems not valid rebuttal and thinks he is Right simply because he is on the right wing not because he has any valid arguments.

You've made a valid argument? When? You've become a joke, Daniel...you're just too dense to recognize that fact! "Hoax"? "Thesis"? "Ad hominem"? "Fallacies"? You babble like Joe Biden when he loses his place on the teleprompter. Things are coming out of your mouth but none of it makes a lick of sense!

Disagree. Daniel didn't just become a joke, he's been one for a very long time. I've had him on ignore for years because of his unending vacuous posts. I told him before I put him on ignore that I have no interest in policing the board, if he would stop writing his empty headed rhetoric to me then I wouldn't put him on ignore. He made a point of writing more vacuous posts. Now I only see him when people respond to his vapor