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Of course, though most atheists are as polite as any person of faith. They note that a virgin birth is improbably (not ridiculous) and the discussion continues from there. For a literal 'seven days' I explain how it is just as likely the original author was using a different definition of the Hebrew 'day' than the more common definition in their time as sunset to sunset (24 hours).You realize that to an atheist, to an unbeliever, a virgin becoming pg is just as ridiculous as God creating the world in seven days.
As I explained before, looking more deeply into word usage and definitions of the time is not an example of scoffing. It is taking an interest in what the original author intended--not how a minister thousands of years later reading a translation into another language determined it meant.If God is God, the talking donkey, the Virgin Birth, Noah's Ark, is all possible. To scoff at any of it is to scoff at all of it.
That is not a bad example. Jesus had told a parable about a man named Lazarus who died and was in the netherworld. However, that would be some embellishment as the two named Lazarus were not at all alike. Still, embellishment is something to look for when studying a story. The account of the sun standing still readily comes to mind.Actually, "he made the whole thing up" is an alternative. Far more likely, he borrowed some from others and embellished upon it.
I am speaking of the other customs mentioned...the stone, the weeping and mourning, wrapping the body. Raising the dead is the miracle in the account.Really? Raising the dead was customary at that time? Not considered miraculous? If so, why would a Jesus bother?
I take your point. I was thinking of issues that cannot be proven--such as the virgin birth. Even so, people can hold the opinion of the flat earth, and it still rates as a valid opinion while at the same time an opinion that can be disproved by facts. (That brings us to 'Those convinced against their will, hold the same opinion still'.) Knowing they are incorrect does not make me any less respectful that they hold that opinion. People can opine on how they see the world.I would take exception to the notion that anyone’s opinion is as valid as any other. One may have the opinion that the earth is flat or that the sun revolves around the earth but that is hardly an informed opinion.
Yep, no proof of miracles. There is no proof the miracles that took place in my own life, either. Since I am unable to dismiss miracles in my own life, I do not dismiss miracles in the Bible. Supernatural events do occur, and the very definition of 'beyond what is natural' assures us there is no proof (or evidence) to be found.You may have an opinion that selected biblical “miracles” took place but that opinion is unsupported and is contrary to all rational existence. You have just hit upon the fatal flaw of biblical miracles as opinion. Never, in all of human history, has any claimed “miracle” ever been substantiated. As long as you must appeal to divine intervention for the explanation of an event, that event can never be provable (or even comprehensible), and therefore can never be part of any rational discussion.
It may be quibbling over definitions but a valid opinion is not valid when there is no plausible connection to reason and rationality. An opinion that the earth is flat is hardly a valid opinion. In regard to biblical stories such as the virgin birth, you cannot escape the fact, (not mere opinion), you have to invoke miracles, and otherwise inexplicable acts of a God.I take your point. I was thinking of issues that cannot be proven--such as the virgin birth. Even so, people can hold the opinion of the flat earth, and it still rates as a valid opinion while at the same time an opinion that can be disproved by facts. (That brings us to 'Those convinced against their will, hold the same opinion still'.) Knowing they are incorrect does not make me any less respectful that they hold that opinion. People can opine on how they see the world.
True. Experience the love of God, and that goes hand-in-hand with the knowledge of how much God loves all.Ingersoll:
"Whoever imagines himself a favorite with God holds other people in contempt.
They are Destroyers, and on the side of the Destroyer. They do not create.
I think the supposed actions of the God clearly shows that such love is selective and capricious. Reality can be harsh and unforgiving. And yes, one can make some oblique case that the ugly, brutal death of a loved one somehow fulfills some better, higher purpose. However, we’re left with the fact that across the natural world, we see nothing that indicates any God provides for humans being any more likely to be saved from a devastating car crash than an Antelope will saved from being a meal for a pride of lions.True. Experience the love of God, and that goes hand-in-hand with the knowledge of how much God loves all.
God's love is neither selective nor capricious. The same love is there whatever our experiences under the heavens. It is that love that brings good out of evil. It does not ignore the evil, it brings good out of it.I think the supposed actions of the God clearly shows that such love is selective and capricious. Reality can be harsh and unforgiving. And yes, one can make some oblique case that the ugly, brutal death of a loved one somehow fulfills some better, higher purpose. However, we’re left with the fact that across the natural world, we see nothing that indicates any God provides for humans being any more likely to be saved from a devastating car crash than an Antelope will saved from being a meal for a pride of lions.
Good is the result of a drunk driver plowing into and killing a family of four.God's love is neither selective nor capricious. The same love is there whatever our experiences under the heavens. It is that love that brings good out of evil. It does not ignore the evil, it brings good out of it.
Good God!Good is the result of a drunk driver plowing into and killing a family of four.
Good God!
We clearly haven't studied religion enough to appreciate its subtle absolutisms.“It is that love that brings good out of evil. It does not ignore the evil, it brings good out of it.”
Somehow, I’m not feelin’ the love.
They are liberals in that sense
and of course most liberals are politically liberal
I've heard of a few who are pro life, so that's a good thing
But as someone once said, it takes more faith to believe in atheism than to believe in Christ...
Can you prove, beyond a shadow of doubt, that it was your version of this Designer and not someone else's version that's responsible for everything?Life, itself, for starters. No atheist has EVER given a good explanation as to how life came about. I've heard a few, very weak possibilities, but even those flimsy explanations can't explain how nothing produced something. The human body and all of its intricate parts and pieces are a work & result of pure design. All designs are produced by a designer.
I don't need to prove it. The Designer proved it for Himself.Can you prove, beyond a shadow of doubt, that it was your version of this Designer and not someone else's version that's responsible for everything?
Stupidity can prompt the victim to see something that's not there for others to see. That is the stick-and-carrot of religion, a self-glossing pathology par excellence.Think about that Judge's statement.
"I can't define pornography, but I know it when I see it."
Apply that.
